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I. How We Work in Washington. Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services. APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
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V. Complaints. Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights. APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.I agree that: A.I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information"). B.APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink. C.APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site. D.If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records. E.This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year. F.You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
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"Live in his home, its mostly ours now." What does this mean? Has your dad transferred ownership to you, or have you taken over the mortgage from him, or do you mean you have taken over most of the space while it still belongs to him?
As SamtheManager pointed out below, you could be liable for neglect if you have not gotten him medical care because you don't want to lose the house for yourselves if he belongs in a facility because his needs are so acute. Whether that is your intention or not, it may definitely give an appearance of impropriety at least.
Burning yourselves out for a house, whether in current time or for a future inheritance, is not worth it and is not guaranteed, as many people who post here have found out.
You've been sassing them for years, and it's not working? Not surprised. It's time to change your communication skills. You don't need to convince the stubborn parent. Why would they change if they've already got you to do everything for them?
Stop being a care slave for your parent and find an alternative that works FOR YOU. Whether that is hiring in-home help, or finding a suitable placement in a care facility. It is NOT abandoning your parent to take them to a nursing home or assisted living home. Some of these places can be quite nice. And they have plenty of skilled caregivers to provide for their resident's needs, 24 hours a day.
Your parent does not need to agree, and they will probably express their displeasure with your decision, but they are not in a position to negotiate this! It is you and your wife who are doing all the work, and are burned out. Beyond burnout you say. This arrangement is not sustainable, and must change for your mental and physical health!
A friend told me I needed to trick my mom into going to get mental health help. I said, "She is crazy, not stupid." Mom refused any help unless it was on her terms. I went no contact and she had other relatives pitch in to help. Finally it got so bad she ended up in the hospital twice. I went and picked her up and took her to a care center and told her I would visit her twice a week. It's been 2 years. You need to do something now, not wait. You need to figure out if it is your house or his house. You can either buy your dad out and own the house or abandon it and go live somewhere else. You can't live together. It's not working. He can say, "No" but you don't have to agree to his "No." You can just leave. Don't allow his manipulation to work on you. You think he might die if you put him in a care home, but in reality he will probably just pitch a toddler hissy fit and be mad. That's what my mom did. That's better than you dying while trying to care for him when you are running on fumes. It gets better when you make a good choice and move forward rather than play by his games. He is not in charge, you are.
I’m sorry the parent is refusing reason and you’re so exhausted. I hope you realize that the parent refusing options does not take away your options. You can choose to save your own time, health, and wellbeing by removing yourself from the situation. It’s what has been required for many elders to accept help from others, while still others have died still refusing. A loving, mentally whole parent would never want this life for you, it is cruel to expect you to give up your life in service. I hope you’ll soon choose you and wish you peace and happiness
P4p38865, welcome to the forum. Parents can be so stubborn at times. I know my Mom refused any outside help, but my Dad was all for it. Mom said no strangers in the house, and when I hired caregivers (thought an agency), Mom chased them out. I then found myself helping them logistically (not hands on) for whatever they needed. Even that was exhausting.
Stand in front of a mirror and say "sorry, I can't possibly do that" over and over until you are comfortable saying it. Your parent might react like your hair is on fire, but eventually will learn. Also, parents look at us like we are still in our 30's and 40's with a ton of energy when in reality we are senior citizens ourselves or close to it. My parents were that way, even when I showed them my AARP membership and my Social Security card, it didn't register.
As many of us here had to do was wait for a serious medical emergency regarding that parent. Mom spent her final months in a nursing home from serious injuries in a fall at her house. Dad hired back the caregivers to help him, and eventually moved (his idea) to senior living. No more sheer panic like we had whenever we saw my parent's phone number on Caller ID.
Is it 1 parent, or 2? Or, is it mostly 1 parent that refuses to get other help?
"Live in his home, its mostly ours now. Well social and Va benefit we got him on. "
Is their only source of income SS? Is that what you mean by "social"? I'm not familiar with VA benefits but others on this forum are.
"79, can't do anything for themselves, even lifting a plastic cup made for a toddler is impossible."
They sound like they might be candidates for LTC. This is good news. Find a good LTC facility that has Medicaid beds and get them assessed. Have them go in on private pay and then when their assets are a few months away from being ompletely drained, then apply for Medicaid.
Can you clarify what you mean that their home is now "mostly" yours? What does this mean in reality? Whose names are on the deed/title? Is there a written purchase contract between them and you?
"Give them no choice, yes tried that failed. I love my father he would die if we said see ya later."
What failed in your resolve. Yes, it is not a pleasant avenue to take but it is temporary and a pathway to a permanent solution. They are not the problem. You are the problem because you are rejecting the only real solution, which is for you to move out and call APS to report them as vulnerable adults.
If your parents do not have assigned PoAs then you have very little power except to move out and stop helping them, and then keep reporting them to APS. This is really all you can do. And do not go over there to assist them. The more you insert yourselves, the longer a permanent solution will take. If these weren't my parents I'd be leaving my husband. As long as you are living in the house with them, there are very few options to get 2 unwilling elders into facility care. It will get bad before it gets better but if you stay the course, it will get better, quicker.
If you have POA, you call 911 and tell EMS you believe dad has had a stroke. Have him transported to the hospital, against his will if you are POA, for a full medical and cognitive workup. If the man cannot even lift up a sippy cup, something serious is wrong with him and he gets no say moving forward. If dementia is at play, it's far more than "early". People who are not mentally compromised do not refuse medical treatment. Stop allowing such a fragile old man to manipulate you any further.
My son once physically lifted his father up and put him in the back seat of his car to go get a colonoscopy. His dad wound up having stage 4 colon cancer and needing immediate surgery.
You say that leaving dad alone will kill him. You not getting him medical treatment right away will likely kill him even faster.
And if the authorities find out that they were living there and not doing anything when a man was in need of help to use a sippy cup and obviously not mentally all there, they might get in trouble for neglect.
Live in his home, its mostly ours now. Well social and Va benefit we got him on. I or we have gone over everything, just seeing if there is something else, we overlooked.
P4, Whose house is it? How is it mostly yours? Did you buy it? Whose name is on the deed? You don't get to move in to his home then complain about how hard it is to live with him. If you can't bear living with him any longer, move. Let him find the services he needs, or help him find services, then make your exit.
You can't worry about what could happen to him living on his own. Many stubborn elders stay in their own home until a tragic accident occurs. If he is a vulnerable adult, unable to make decisions on his own, you can call Adult Protective Services to check on him and do an assessment. If he has given you POA, and he is mentally compromised, then you make the decisions for his care, without his agreement.
Is the house supposed to go to you when he dies? And you're just biding your time, waiting for that to happen? What if he goes on like this another 5 years? 10 years? 20? Will you survive that long? His house may have to be sold to pay for his care. If he applies for Medicaid, the house will have to be sold and the funds used for his care, or Medicaid will put a lien on the property after his death. Unless your name was added to the deed long ago, you're never going to have that house, unless you want to continue like you are and kill yourselves waiting and hoping to inherit a house. That's your choice.
Thanks for responding, P4. It sounds like he hasn't given you any POA, or has he? Do you live with him in his home, or does he live with you in yours, or do you go to his home from yours to provide his care? What is his financial situation?
79, can't do anything for themselves, even lifting a plastic cup made for a toddler is impossible. Medical diagnose, impossible, he won't have any blood work done. I'm no doctor however I believe he is showing signs of early dementia. Give them no choice, yes tried that failed. I love my father he would die if we said see ya later.
You don't have to say see ya later like that, you have a nice and normal conversation. You tell them your own health is suffering and you can't do this anymore. If you are in his house with the hopes of having it later on, that might not work out if it isn't in your name already. You could end up homeless in this circumstance.
Well, you give the parent cold hard facts, such as "We are beyond burnout. We're exhausted. As of May 1, we're no longer available. Here are brochures from Visiting Angels, Helping Hands, Home Instead, and Happy Meadows Care Facility. You decide what type of care you want and can pay for, and we'll stop by and see you once a week or so while you get used to your new life."
Then disappear. Have tickets for Tahiti - or at least Memphis and a tour of Graceland - ready. And then go.
Good luck with your new freedom! You're going to love it. Send them post cards.
What are parent’s health issues? Mobility? Incontinence? Dementia? Need more information. Wandering & getting lost? Agitation? You don’t explain what are the problems. Do you live with parent? What is age? Are you a senior citizen too?
Since easing them into it hasn't worked for years, you just give them no choice: "We are reclaiming our lives and ending our care and support two weeks from today. You can hire outside help, or you can be left alone. Make your decision." Then follow through. If you live at his or her house, move out. If he or she lives at your house, move them out. If necessary, call Adult Protective Service and tell them that there is a vulnerable at-risk senior who will be on their own two weeks from today, and let them arrange for whatever your stubborn relative needs.
No one can force you to take care of them. It has been your choice to do this. Make the choices you need now for your own health and safety, both mental and physical. You matter too, and you deserve peace and health. If you can share more information, the members here have a wealth of information and wisdom and can bring you lots of helpful clarity.
Please use the search to read all you can about caregiving and the trials/tribulations of you role.
Always remember, You are not alone. Many questions can be answered through the search or posting yourself. Please stay on the forum and use it as a valuable tool to navigate the difficult role of caregiving.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
A.
I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
B.
APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
C.
APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
D.
If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records.
E.
This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year.
F.
You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
As SamtheManager pointed out below, you could be liable for neglect if you have not gotten him medical care because you don't want to lose the house for yourselves if he belongs in a facility because his needs are so acute. Whether that is your intention or not, it may definitely give an appearance of impropriety at least.
Burning yourselves out for a house, whether in current time or for a future inheritance, is not worth it and is not guaranteed, as many people who post here have found out.
It's time to change your communication skills.
You don't need to convince the stubborn parent. Why would they change if they've already got you to do everything for them?
Stop being a care slave for your parent and find an alternative that works FOR YOU. Whether that is hiring in-home help, or finding a suitable placement in a care facility. It is NOT abandoning your parent to take them to a nursing home or assisted living home. Some of these places can be quite nice. And they have plenty of skilled caregivers to provide for their resident's needs, 24 hours a day.
Your parent does not need to agree, and they will probably express their displeasure with your decision, but they are not in a position to negotiate this! It is you and your wife who are doing all the work, and are burned out. Beyond burnout you say. This arrangement is not sustainable, and must change for your mental and physical health!
Stand in front of a mirror and say "sorry, I can't possibly do that" over and over until you are comfortable saying it. Your parent might react like your hair is on fire, but eventually will learn. Also, parents look at us like we are still in our 30's and 40's with a ton of energy when in reality we are senior citizens ourselves or close to it. My parents were that way, even when I showed them my AARP membership and my Social Security card, it didn't register.
As many of us here had to do was wait for a serious medical emergency regarding that parent. Mom spent her final months in a nursing home from serious injuries in a fall at her house. Dad hired back the caregivers to help him, and eventually moved (his idea) to senior living. No more sheer panic like we had whenever we saw my parent's phone number on Caller ID.
"Live in his home, its mostly ours now. Well social and Va benefit we got him on. "
Is their only source of income SS? Is that what you mean by "social"? I'm not familiar with VA benefits but others on this forum are.
"79, can't do anything for themselves, even lifting a plastic cup made for a toddler is impossible."
They sound like they might be candidates for LTC. This is good news. Find a good LTC facility that has Medicaid beds and get them assessed. Have them go in on private pay and then when their assets are a few months away from being ompletely drained, then apply for Medicaid.
Can you clarify what you mean that their home is now "mostly" yours? What does this mean in reality? Whose names are on the deed/title? Is there a written purchase contract between them and you?
"Give them no choice, yes tried that failed. I love my father he would die if we said see ya later."
What failed in your resolve. Yes, it is not a pleasant avenue to take but it is temporary and a pathway to a permanent solution. They are not the problem. You are the problem because you are rejecting the only real solution, which is for you to move out and call APS to report them as vulnerable adults.
If your parents do not have assigned PoAs then you have very little power except to move out and stop helping them, and then keep reporting them to APS. This is really all you can do. And do not go over there to assist them. The more you insert yourselves, the longer a permanent solution will take. If these weren't my parents I'd be leaving my husband. As long as you are living in the house with them, there are very few options to get 2 unwilling elders into facility care. It will get bad before it gets better but if you stay the course, it will get better, quicker.
My son once physically lifted his father up and put him in the back seat of his car to go get a colonoscopy. His dad wound up having stage 4 colon cancer and needing immediate surgery.
You say that leaving dad alone will kill him. You not getting him medical treatment right away will likely kill him even faster.
You don't get to move in to his home then complain about how hard it is to live with him. If you can't bear living with him any longer, move. Let him find the services he needs, or help him find services, then make your exit.
You can't worry about what could happen to him living on his own. Many stubborn elders stay in their own home until a tragic accident occurs.
If he is a vulnerable adult, unable to make decisions on his own, you can call Adult Protective Services to check on him and do an assessment.
If he has given you POA, and he is mentally compromised, then you make the decisions for his care, without his agreement.
Is the house supposed to go to you when he dies? And you're just biding your time, waiting for that to happen? What if he goes on like this another 5 years? 10 years? 20? Will you survive that long? His house may have to be sold to pay for his care. If he applies for Medicaid, the house will have to be sold and the funds used for his care, or Medicaid will put a lien on the property after his death.
Unless your name was added to the deed long ago, you're never going to have that house, unless you want to continue like you are and kill yourselves waiting and hoping to inherit a house. That's your choice.
Then disappear. Have tickets for Tahiti - or at least Memphis and a tour of Graceland - ready. And then go.
Good luck with your new freedom! You're going to love it. Send them post cards.
No one can force you to take care of them. It has been your choice to do this. Make the choices you need now for your own health and safety, both mental and physical. You matter too, and you deserve peace and health. If you can share more information, the members here have a wealth of information and wisdom and can bring you lots of helpful clarity.
Always remember, You are not alone. Many questions can be answered through the search or posting yourself. Please stay on the forum and use it as a valuable tool to navigate the difficult role of caregiving.
Age of parent and health problems?
Are you caring for them in your home, their home or are they in an Assisted Living, Memory Care or Longterm care?
Is Medicaid involved?
Give a little backgound. Like years you have been caring for them.