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Yes. Switzerland is a viable option, but expensive and far away. Here is another interesting option, recently written up in the NY Times. https://www.dezeen.com/2019/05/22/philip-nitschke-death-pod-design/amp/. A death pod, developed recently. Expensive as well, but not as expensive as my moms 10, 000 a month Skilled Nursing, or other facilities. Myself and my youngest sibling, who is mentally I’ll are moms only surviving children. I am the oldest, 68 and live 400 miles away, traveling to visit regularly. She is 92 , has lived alone, falling often for 18 years, so far. She is relatively safe now, but it has been an exhausting journey. I would never want to subject my kids to it….
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I don't think about that for myself, just want to be comfortable and not in a lot of pain. My husband though talks about finding a way out before he becomes unable to take care of himself. We are 73 and 76 and both have our individual health issues that will for sure get worse, but we eat right and exercise to stave off the inevitable. I try to live in the now. He worries. Interesting topic. I like to think that I do not know until I get there how I will feel about being really sick, but the dementia diagnosis keeping one from deciding for themselves certainly is concerning. My father committed suicide and I wish either a medication to stop his pain had been found or an assisted suicide had been available to him instead of the violent way he went out. It was too horrifying for those of us left behind.
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PeggySue2020 Apr 2022
We have a gun too. And have met ppl and families charged with cleaning up what remains.

Years back, an article came out about how ppl were going to Mexico for bottles of liquid barbiturate intended for animal euthanasia. The people would just drink them and hope to go out like Marilyn Monroe.
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2 words, Dr G (Dr Garavaglia)
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reallyfedup Apr 2022
Thanks for sending but genes are genes and you can't get around that. I eat a very careful diet. I don't exercise as much as I should but that will improve with the weather. I still face an excellent chance at getting dementia.
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I believe that we shouldn't artificially prolong life but, ultimately God has numbered our days, so...

I live in an area that is a huge snowbird and retirement community, far and wide, every small town, every place within 200 miles has catered to the aged for decades.

We have so many silver alerts and I can not help but think, these are without variation, people that have Alzheimer or dementia, did they knowingly walk away to let nature take it's course? It doesn't take long in our extreme heat to become unconscious and die. Sounds like a good option if you can no longer have any quality of life.
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AlvaDeer Apr 2022
RR, it was Dorothy Parker whose poem told us that while many of us want to/are willing to cash in our chips it isn't all that easy to "find a way". You have just mentioned a very favorite of mine. Puts me in mind of those found in snowdrifts, gone away, after a lovely eve. of gambling in Tahoe, thinking they can make their way back to the hotel by some "short cut". So often it doesn't work out. I am pretty sure it wasn't their intention, but in cases where it is the intention, one can see how easily it could be done. Dip too long in the Pacific, playing in the waves, and one understands how quickly hypothermia can take us out. Happens all the time.
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I seriously wish to have the right to end my life, should I be diagnosed with Alzeheimer/dementia. BUT my more intense reaction, to my parent’s poor health/dementia, and mom’s very difficult mobility issues, is too stay as healthy as possible. To do what I did not see role modeled. The women on mom’s side were inclined to be obese, overweight, not active, so I’ve worked hard, to stay a healthy weight, move daily, stay active and live with discipline. It’s ingrained in me to live one day at a time, cause I got sober, with 12 steps, at age 24, almost 40 years ago, and those steps guide me daily. Thankful. Every. Day.

Instead of feeling like I’m going to end up like my elders, I’m doing my best to stay independent, continue challenging myself, keep learning tech, embrace change, declutter, all the stuff I saw my MIL doing, but she still got Alzeheimers. My own mom did very little of those things, and she is dealing more with loss of mobility, but def has dementia. Both our parents have official diagnoses of memory loss disease, but their memories are better than they are bad, now. They still know us kids, remember lots, but forget lots.

So if it gets me, I’d appreciate opting out, but will plan, with my husband for what we do, if not possible. We used to joke that since we want to go together, we’d simply jump on an iceberg, and float off to our fate, happily heading for whatever is next, together. As we age, we realize it is better to make actual realistic plans, because burdening our children, with our lack of preparation, or because we wanted things done our way, with no regard to the burden it will bear on our two kids, is not for us.

I feel like a traitor, even writing these words, but living under this, the past 4-8 years, watching our parent’s deteriorating health, and their increasing dependence, on their youngest daughter, our youngest sister, has also made life tough. I won’t go into it here, but things are the way they are because it is the way our mom, dad and sister want it. They live together, always have, their choice, never discussed with the three older sisters. It is what it is.

This is my first post, and the subject brought me out from under the covers, as I’ve been lurking this forum, for over four years. You’ve helped keep me sane. We’re all just doing our best to support our sister and parents, always have, too much to say to tell the story, but know that lack of communication is deadly, and memory loss disease, combined with immobility, incontinence and poor health, is a lot to deal with, so I want the easy way out, in case doing everything possible to avoid it, does not work.

Thanks for having a place for people to go for excellent, honest, caring advice. I’ve experienced how much people can help each other, just by sharing their troubles and solutions. It works!
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AlvaDeer Apr 2022
Please please stay out from under the covers. We can't find you there!!!!!! We really are a very good community and only very occasionally get ticked off with one another!
Do know that even when we have "intent" not to "go there" very few of us, even when we have a means at hand, willingly exit this life. Even those in pain at the end of life. When I was in nursing I was taught that by a Priest. So dire was his condition that nurses went in two by two and wept outside his room questioning why "his God" didn't take him to peace. Yet one night he said to me "If the pain meds put me out could you wake me at 9?" I said "Sure, but WHY?" and he said "Quincy's on then". So while we prayed for him to die this gentle man wanted one more episode of that Coroner's program, Quincy, on TV.
Believers would say it isn't to us to make the time. Others say is is/can be. I think most of us would be comforted to know we COULD have a painless exit if we wanted it, even tho few of us would likely use it.
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I know someone who at around age 70 made a conscious decision to die. She had been schizophrenic all her adult life and lived in a care home due to various ailments. She notified her family, who respected her decision. She then stopped eating and drinking. It took about 5 days.
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AlvaDeer Apr 2022
Jamie Raskin's beautiful Memoir of his son's death, Unthinkable, let's us know the absolute agony of some who suffer mental illnesses. The agony of their parents. Their inability often to go on, and the grief of those helpless to help them.
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I want a cocktail of meds that will send me off peacefully into the abyss. I'll get my own personal stash (saving up for that rainy day) and wash it down with an exquisite glass of wine. Seriously, watching my mother decline from Vascular Dementia, I know this is a place I never want to visit. Although she has been demanding and manipulative her entire life, and I still (working on it) harbor many grievances, this has been a very long, hard road for all of us. As we boomers age it will strain our health care system beyond capacity.......I think it is imperative we all have the choice to die with at least some shred if dignity. There is no humanity in making people live under such dire circumstances.
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TChamp Apr 2022
Your plan to end your life sounds great. The problem is that if you get dementia, you won't know you got it. Then, you beautiful plan will be all forgotten.
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A French journalist named Hugo Clement did a video interview not too long ago with an elderly French woman -- who didn't seem sick or in ill health when he interviewed her -- who had signed the papers making arrangements for assisted suicide in Switzerland. You might be able to find it online if you google his name and "assisted suicide" or something like that.
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I'm surprised and strangely comforted to learn that I'm not the only one who has thought about suicide rather than live with dementia. I've watched my mother decline over the years. She's in memory care now, and somewhat adjusting. I have no children or family to help me (who would help me) and I know now that I wasted many years "helping" my mother instead of living my life, maintaining friendships, working two more years, so much more. I don't want to do that to anyone. Maybe I'm feeling negative because I haven't yet recovered from all years of caregiving.
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reallyfedup Apr 2022
You don't need me to say it but I will anyway: You've been through a lot. You have a right to feel tired and negative right now. It's tiring and can be unpleasant to be a caregiver.

As for my interest in assisted suicide, I've lived with a serious and complicated mood disorder since I was about 7. I'm now 66. I have pursued treatment for years and years and really there is not much medicine has to offer. I spent a few hours today looking for research studies but so many of them cut off at 65 if not sooner. I am looking for an interdisciplinary mood disorder program that will help me give me as accurate a diagnosis as possible,. I'm also interested in the brain-gut axis, which addresses microbiome health, newer talk therapies, and psychedelic treatments like ketamine. So I'm not giving up just yet. Even so, what keeps me sane through all this is the knowledge that I can quit when I want, albeit after my husband is gone if I outlive him. I think I've had enough and the significant possibility I will get dementia ties it up like a bow. My best to you.
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It was a beautiful sunny day, and my neighbor and I were talking about the usual neighbor stuff. Somehow we got onto the topic of dementia and we’re soon sharing tips as it were on how to accomplish our right to die before that diagnosis. It was rather Kevorkianesque, but also realistic.

I expect right to die to become easier as boomers age.
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AlvaDeer Apr 2022
EXACTLY. Once the cost of keeping us is too much we will see easier access to the right to die. I have always said that PS. As a nurse I saw things change once humans weren't used as ATM withdrawal machines by the medical system. Before that Doctors would argue with family to keep someone alive just so they got their money. Once there was little money to be made for Hospitals and doctors with that it was then that things changed. It went from "Are you SAYING you want me to LET YOUR LOVED ONE DIE!!!!" to "Are you saying you want your loved one to stay in this TORMENT instead of allowing them peace!!!!!" ........ it all happened, that change, very quickly. It is still a world in which we should "follow the money" for the most part.
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It's a rational thought. Assisted suicide does help people with ALS, MS, terminal cancer and other lethal conditions. Dementia is indeed an exception because like you say, you have to be mentally competent to make that decision. However, you don't have dementia and may be you will never get it. There is no way to predict dementia. It's a lottery and nobody knows who will be the loser. Why worrying so much now?
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reallyfedup Apr 2022
I hope I don't get it. But both my parents had it and I've been on drugs that increase the chances of developing it. Also, my particular mental disorder, which I've now had for 60 years negatively affects the brain. My life span according to the statistics is much shorter than the unaffected person and even now I can feel my cognition getting bit shakier. So, rather than worry about it, I have decided to take it into my own hands. This has given me a lot of peace.
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Author Amy Bloom has recently written a Memoir about her Husband's determination, when diagnosed with early Alzheimer's to avail himself of Dignitas in Switzerland to make his "final exit" by his own plan and on his own timetable. While it is loaded into my Kindle at present I haven't yet read it. It is called In Love: a Memoir of Love and Loss. Dignatas is not open to all in that it costs on average 10,000 to go there. It is one of the few places one can LEGALLY make a final exit with a diagnosis of age alone. You might wish to read her book.
Facebook also has a page called Final Exit that can be joined should you wish further discussion on self-deliverance.
As a nurse I have of course discussed this subject endlessly with fellow medical staff. Many feel we should have more options on timing our exit.
I would caution that some of your thinking involves fears of loss, an almost planned depression, and one should never act when thinking is in that realm. More than you can know plan their exit when ill. It isn't widely discussed, I fear.
It is a subject I wish was more discussed, but Americans have quite a determination to avoid discussion of the hard stuff.
I would venture to say only to know that you are not alone in your thinking.
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TChamp Apr 2022
The expense for a dignify end of life in Switzerland, is probably a bargain if you consider the cost of Memory Care and nursing homes in the U.S. Most members in this forum prefer to live in a world of fantasy and wishful thinking. They get mad when I spell the naked truth. They acuse me of not "offering support". In other words, not following the fantasies of the herd.
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Yes, I have thought about it. My brother has early onset Alz. He is 4 years older than me, so YES, I am scared of being such a huge burden on my kids and husband. That said, I am doing everything I can to try and circumvent the possibility of going down that road. I follow the Bredesen Protocol and read constantly about what is new in this field. It has helped me if nothing else, to feel like I am doing something positive.
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reallyfedup Apr 2022
I don't know what that is, but I'll look into it. Thanks.
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Just stop seeing your doctor... ever.
Discontinue all your medications now, including any over the counter supplements.
Eat, drink and be merry.
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Christine44 Apr 2022
I met someone who did just that -- stopped seeing her doctor(s) and discontinued all her medications. She also had a "do not resuscitate" order in place in her hospital. This is what happened, or at least this was her version of what happened; although she was definitely on the "strange" side, she did seem quite intelligent and I couldn't then or now see any reason why she would lie to me. After stopping medications/seeing a doctor, etc. she had a lot of heart problems and had a major stroke & was on the operating table, she said, for many hours. As a result of this, when I met her she had huge mobility problems, that seem to come with suffering a serious stroke ("spastic" movements) that affected both her gait and her head/shoulder movements. I asked her why her "do not resuscitate" order was not honored when she had the stroke, which should have kept her from being kept alive, and having a long heart operation. She replied: "Hospitals do what they want to do." Someone else recently said to me something similar about hospitals: "Hospitals are in the business of keeping people alive."
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I have already taken legal steps to be placed in a very good local residential care center with a “stepped placement” set up so that my care will be appropriate to my needs, and I have always been focused philosophically on the intention that miracles are identified and discovered every other day.

If a medication comes along that actually does restore cognitive integrity, I’ll want it to be tried on earth.

My own LO is presently declining significantly, as did her mother and my mother, but SOME of the other members of this side of my family, even with significant disease process (PD), retained their cognitive integrity to the very end. No extraordinary measure will be provided, but she receives exemplary care in her SNF, and I keep an eye on things almost everyday.

I’m too nosy to want to cut myself off from my natural future, whatever it may hold.

Nothing at all contentious here. We all need to think this out and do the best we can for ourselves.
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reallyfedup Apr 2022
I applaud you and your graceful statement. You sound like a wonderful person and I respect your point of view.
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Yes - I agree too. I also wish it were not such a contentious subject as it is not listed in the Care Topics menu.
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since my father has heart failure ive been thinking alot about how i will end up since i dont have kids and wont have any and not married..... i do not want to be put in a nursing home which i will be bur i am afraid of death.... but i think at that point of my life i hope i come to terms with death and i would totally do assisted suicide as long as i was terminal.
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reallyfedup Apr 2022
I applaud you and your graceful statement.
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its a contentious subject, but yes, I agree with you.
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AlvaDeer Apr 2022
Mstrbill, it is interesting but it has turned out NOT to be contentious. I expected so many more to come to us with the religiously based "Only God can decide..." but that hasn't been the case. I am amazed how many are thinking of this and LONGING to speak of it.
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