Driving evaluations. What if he passes?

My mothers forgetfulness was to the point she should not drive.
On the downlow, I asked her general practitioner to intervene.
Testing progression of dementia was part of her routine checkup.
About a week or so later, My mom received an ominous letter from the state:
she must surrender her license within 30 days. Only after doing so could
she retest.
Surrendering her license was traumatic. I pretended to be as upset as she was.
I said the doctor has no choice but to notify the state of his findings.
I also said "Mom, I know you can drive. Your a better driver than I am (actually true). But the doctor-and I-are concerned about your forgetfulness while your driving."
We talked briefly about retesting. A few times she forgot she no longer had a drivers license, and I'd have to reexplain. Shortly thereafter, I simply did all the driving.

This is likley one of the top issues when independence is threatened due to declining abilities. And, in addition, it carries the additional responsibility of possibly killing others. Not an easy situation for anyone.
This is my experience and suggestions:
* Read webinar TEEPA SNOW re this issue (elders driving, no license).
* Dismantle part of the car so it will not start.
* Hide or change the keys so the door(s) won't open.
* If license not renewed, make the DMV the 'bad guy' - not you. Take yourself out of the equation.
* As necessary, alert local Police of situation (in case he calls them) - my client reported her son to police ... so he had to let them know as she was calling 'often'.
* Of course he thinks he can drive. These thoughts are based on fear of losing independence. And, it is a lot of independence to lose from my perspective.
* Perhaps, if safe enough get him a three wheeler bike. My 101 year old client still rides ! and just stopped driving. Although she is one in a million. Still, she now relies on her bike for transportation and is fiercely independent.
* I've read that some medical providers do not want to be bothered with this - so even if a letter or no letter, at times the DMV hands are tied. DO what YOU have to do to potentially save his and others' lives. Gena

I would ask the doctor and motor vehicle how to handle this issue. And I would find a way to make the car "not work". When the time comes that he has to face he can't drive (and make sure it is legitimate and a valid reason), there is ONE thing you MUST DO IF YOU TAKE THE CAR AWAY. You must assure him that no matter what, someone will always be available to take him where and when he needs to go. AND KEEP YOUR WORD. One of the most fiendish and cruel things to do to a senior is to take their car - and if you do, then YOU MUST MAKE ARRANGEMENTS TO TRANSPORT THEM. If you don't do that, then don't take the car.

I just did this last year- I went to DMV and got a form saying why I think he shouldn’t drive and his diagnoses of dementia/Alzheimer’s. I Just sent it in and he got notified by the ADOTT. And never tell him, it’s been so much easier complaining WITH Him instead of defending why he’s a danger ⚠️ Good Luck

Imho, disable HIS auto by any means possible and remove him as a driver on your auto insurance policy.

My dad loved his car...Mercedes. He spent time polishing and tweaking it. After we put my mom in a nursing home because I could no longer care for her (they lived with us), I followed Dad home from the NH one day. Oh my! He was weaving all over the road. Thankful it was only a 5 min drive. I promptly took away his keys. A very hard thing to do. He really resisted but I took his keys anyway. I started driving him to the NH 2X/day and anywhere he needed to go. We scheduled a family vacation. I made arrangements for him to stay in a guest room at the NH to be close to Mom. The neighbor across the street knew the situation. Before we were gone for 1 day, my neighbor let me know that the NH van had dropped him off. He then used the other set of keys I didn’t know about to continue driving while we were gone. Unfortunately, he was addicted to oxycodone because of severe back pain - the cause of his driving issue.

We face this with my FIL too. Dr's said No, social workers said No but he NEEDED to feel we were on his side. He has duel demensias ASLD and Vascular. He has had a major stroke that did quite a bit of damage, his Cog scores are low. His movement and reflexes are limited. He needs a walker and shuffle walks. I know he can't pass, but we got him a booklet anyway. We told him to study and every so often we let him do an online practice test, he fails miserably missing at least half the questions. We keep telling him study and when you pass we will request a full re-evaluation. We know the state isn't going to give it back but it gives him hope and makes him feel like he has some say in it all. I can't tell you if that would help your case but he can't read/write well this might be an idea you could utilize.

This is what I do professionally: qualify people to take the driving evaluation (or not). Some insist that I let them even after I tell them they won't pass. This is a pass/fail evaluation, with results reported to your state motor vehicle administration. If he does not pass, his license is immediately revoked. If he doesn't turn it in they will come to your home (at least in Maryland) to take it from him. If he does pass, he can drive legally. He will be "on the radar" and can be required to re-test every 2 years to maintain qualification.

You can report him to your state motor vehicle department, medical office. They will review his medical records to see if he has any conditions or diagnoses that could impair his driving ability. They will then require him to be evaluated or surrender his license.

Veterans can usually get this evaluation for free at a local VA hospital.

The testing involves completing forms (don't help him), a cognitive test, tests for speed of reflexes, and on-the-road testing in their car, not his.

Do not involve his MD unless you are sure he thinks DH can't drive or there are medical records with a cognitive diagnosis. Do talk to his eye doctor to be certain he has the acuity, peripheral vision and depth perception to be a safe driver. If these have not been tested find another eye doctor.

Bottom line: don't worry about DH passing. I have never seen a patient pass who didn't really have the skills to drive safely. The people doing the testing are professional OTs or PTs who understand what is required to be a safe driver.

If your husband truly cant drive safely the DMv will know. They are trained to evaluate these situations.

I am not sure this fits in your category, but many years ago when my mother-in-law was 89, she was able to renew her license by mail. I contacted the DMV and they said they couldn't discriminate because of age. At that time I didn't feel dementia was even a factor. She could barely see over the steering wheel.

It looks like now you at least have some options to prevent your spouse from driving.

I am facing the same with my mom. Dr said no after she failed her dementia test which she claimes they set her up to fail.
Long and short, find a driving instructor , I am using a company called 911 driving, to do a refresh drive. They are or should be, as this one is, mandated to report. I dont think my mom will make it out of the neighboor hood before he says no...
But if someone passes your family member to drive, keep the documentation, if accident occurs, then liability passes to them, not you. Sad but at least you tried....

The place where I took mom to be tested for dementia also did a simulated driving test.  It not only measured their reactions to things but their response time.  Mom failed the test twice.  I said to her that I didn't think she could live with herself if she were to kill a child or a car filled with a young family.  After explaining that her slowed response time could very well result in a tragedy... she seemed more agreeable to not driving.

Hello JanBro, I’d do as others have said. Notify the DMV in writing about your concerns and have them send him the request to be evaluated or his license will be revoked on such and such a date. IF he passes and you still think he is a danger to himself and others, you will need to step in and be “ the bad guy” to take away his keys. I was the bad guy to both of my parents. The moron at the DMV who gave my dad his test, allowed him to do it old style ( pencil/paper) vs on the computer. No way he could have figured out the computer thing which is what I was banking on. After he told examiner he was there because he “ got lost” and police had to be involved, the examiner still made it easy for him to take the written test. He failed the test and she let him take it AGAIN until he passed. There was no behind the wheel test, just the written one and he passed. UNBELIEVABLE. There were and will be people who say, “oh well, you did what you could.” I disagreed with that thought since I’d been in the car with my dad repeatedly and saw that he did dangerous things. The doc wrote a note that my dad was incapable of driving, the DMV was notified and the passing of the drivers written test was a joke. I took away his keys, got screamed at, threatened and all that goes with being the bad guy. It was awful, but NOBODY ended up being killed by my dad’s driving and no law suits threatening to take away everything happened. He was no longer allowed to drive. However, I didn’t strand my parents. I took them wherever they wanted or needed to go. To this day, I don’t regret the decision made to keep society safe from my dad’s dangerous driving. There is no way on earth any of us could have lived with him having hurt or killed anyone because we “ did all we could” but still allowed him to drive.

I didn’t get to read all the comments but just a couple things I learned:
1) At least in our state, you can “report” a questionable driver. Then it is on the driver.
2) The physician usually has to sign off once they are reported. My FIL’s refused to sign off. Please he gave instructions that NO ONE in the facility was to help him get a license. Not with a phone call or anything. He had to “figure it out” on his own.
3) I believe the physician can just report him or sign something that says he is no longer capable of driving.

Dad was 96+ and still had his license. I think he got to the point where he preferred being driven around. I'd say the last 9 months of his life is when he preferred it that way. I think he had a milder dementia towards the end. Since we were a live in team, he became the backup in case I needed an emergency driver. The last 2 years my brothers wanted to take away his license, but only because they observed him doing the rolling right at the corner of the street where my brother lived. At first I was concerned, then I watched every neighbor never stp at the stop sign either, from teenagers to anyone younger than Dad. Nobody stopped at the sign unless there was a car coming. Which is exactly what Dad did as well. And his driving habits were simply superior to just about anyone else that drove around on the roads. He slowed & stopped for stale yellow lights, maintained his lane, was at the speed limit, didn't tailgate, this at 95+ years old. I looked at my brothers and really just said to them. The day any of you drive as well as he does, consistently, every time, that's the day you can approach him about requesting he stop driving. I really couldn't justify punishing him & taking his driving privileges away when the police don't drive within the speed limit laws like Dad did.

Consider writing a letter to the evaluator and presenting it to him or her at the start of the evaluation. In the letter, list your concerns. If someone else can co-sign it, all the better. You might want to have the letter notarized, to make it more official.

If you have access to a lawyer, you can sign an affidavit and present it to the evaluator.

Dear JanBro,
I write from the perspective of the patient. I was diagnosed with Early Onset ALZ 5 yrs ago a month before my 57th birthday. My Neuro Doctor said, I was the first patient to bring up the subject of driving. I have been a patient of hers for 15 yrs. She disagreed with the Neuropsych report that said I should immediately stop driving. We agreed at all further appointments she would test me neurologically, and carry on the driving discussion. Last year, for no other reason than I thought it was time for me to stop driving I told my DW I was hanging up the car keys. My Neuro Doctor, says I am the first patient to voluntarily give up my license in the 20 yrs she's been practicing medicine. The workers at DMV didn't know what to do with me. I was told, the only people that come in to surrender their license are drivers who have been sent to them by the courts, or their doctor's.
My point is, that I think every family should have the driving discussion as soon as a diagnosis of Dementia is established. I have had friends who had ALZ and they would not give up driving until the doctor reported them to the DMV. A couple had several accidents before their licenses were pulled from them by the court, which is the situation none of our families should want for themselves. This is a sensitive subject, and an uncomfortable topic for families to bring up. I know my DW didn't think I needed to stop driving, but I just told her for me it was, time to give it up. My DW and adult children now have to take me everywhere I go. Yes it is a burden on the adult children, but they know Mom can't do it all being that she is still working and as a teacher in the COVID-19 era, puts in between 16-19hrs a day teaching, and preparing all of the reports and lesson plans that must be customized to each students needs.
Please keep in mind, how you'd feel if your DH, had an accident that would injure either himself or someone else in your community. Your comment of What if he passes a driving evaluation, if your DH still has an alert enough mind and reflexes to respond to driving situations, make an agreement with your DH to have follow up driving evaluations whenever you think it is necessary or on a schedule that the driving examiner thinks is appropriate based on his skills or lack of them. Let the driving examiner be the bad guy. I hope this is helpful.

I have the same situation. The dr gave me some places that do driving evaluations and I simply haven’t set it up. My husband has had strokes and infrequently remembers we have the list. I just keep putting it off. How long has it been since he drove? My husband wanted to try one day then got really nervous and didn’t. It’s been 1-2 years since he drove

All you can do it get him the test. If they pass him, you have done all that you can. Report him to the DMV, they may require him to take a test, they may not. See an attorney that specializes in elder care and find out what your liability is if you share insurance and both of your names are on the car etc. . We had to have my mother evaluated and she failed the evaluation . She was furious and insisted that she was going to get her license back no matter the cost. It took awhile for her to accept the situation, but she finally did.

Get someone else to ride with him and tell you how he's doing. Not really knowing the situation, I will say that it's possible you have become more anxious as a rider. In my late teens and younger years, I was the person who had no fear and taught people how to drive. I did it for a couple of my siblings. Now I find myself being very nervous riding with someone because I feel they are going too fast in wet weather, tailing too close to the driver in front of us, etc. While my driver feels as in control as I used to, I don't feel comfortable any more. I find very few drivers that I am confident in these days.

If hubby is having problems driving (too slow on freeway, tailgating slower drivers to intimidate to make them go faster, etc), I'm sure the tester will see it. Many people have driving habits, developed over the years, that will prevent them from passing a test. Unless he has dementia and there is a fear of becoming lost or obvious bad driving that concerns you, I would just let him take the test. DMV and doctor can become involved if he has other medical issues.

Without knowing the full issues with your dad its hard to make a pinpoint suggestion. my dad thought he could drive also, but i rode with him one time and was a little concerned. when he got something from DOT to take test, dad said he would just get the doctor to sign off. I said they can't just do that, he had to take eye test, and other stuff. I told my dad that honestly it was not safe for him to be on the road DUE TO OTHER DRIVERS NOT DRIVING SAFELY. I put it on the "other person". Now for you, either you speak with the doctor privately and tell him that you don't feel your dad is capable of driving and let the driver tell your dad that NO he will not sign off for a test..........but IF the doctor doesn't believe you and says he can take drivers test......when you take your dad to have the test done, let the "tester" know of his conditions and that you feel he is not safe to drive and let the "tester" make the decision. OR you can just somehow disable the car. wishing you luck.

My in laws were both diagnosed with dementia but my FIL was the only one driving. All the kids talked to him about not driving but they both argued they needed to go out even though she couldn't even get out to the car easily because of bad knees she refused to have fixed. My sister in law moved in to help them but dropped the ball. They got in the car one evening and drove 40 miles away and ended up in a ditch. They didn't know where they were, why they were there or how they got there. Luckily they were not hurt but the car was damaged. My brother in law does estimates on auto damage and he wrote it up as a total loss for them. They had no choice but to accept it. They complain about not being able to go out on their own but we have no guilt as they can't tell you if they've eaten 5 minutes after they have. We feel so much better knowing they are not on the road.

You never stated why you think he should no longer drive..

Has he had multiple accidents Let?

Is his eyesight failing and he can't see well enough to drive?

does he have dementia and not rememberING things?

Let him be evaluated.

Unless he is evaluated, how do you know he can't continue to drive?

You can contact your local DMV directly and tell them that there is an unsafe driver in your household that should not be driving, but refuses to stop. They can actually administer a driving test to him that will prove that he is unsafe. Your MD does not need to become involved.

Take away the keys and then sell the car. If you still drive, keep the keys on your person at all times so your husband cannot "borrow" your car. You do not want your husband to get lost driving. You do not want him to get into an accident and kill himself or some innocent person. Take away keys and sell car. Problem solved.

The biggest problem of all is preventing the driving by those with dementia.

Many doctors don't want to get involved. Some do, many don't. Even DMV rules can be bizarre (The state my mother lived in required self-reporting dementia! HAH! Like that would happen.) Testing can be inconclusive.

In the end, no matter how someone with dementia is told they can't drive anymore, the "drive" is still there and they WILL attempt it, whether they have a valid license or not.

It is better if the doctor will tell them AND put it in writing (make a copy, so when they rip it up and throw it away, you can print another!) It will put the biggest onus on the doctor. If an evaluation is done and the person fails, same thing should be done - have it documented in writing and save a copy!

BUT, the actual prevention will fall to you. Best recommendation is to ensure the car is disabled in some way until YOU disable it to use it. Keep the keys in a secure place, where they can't access them. Install "The Club" or have a kill switch installed. Always ensure the person doesn't see how the preventative devices are used. Despite short term memory loss, it is sometimes amazing what will stick with them! I just read an article about a couple who "escaped" their MC facility by observing the codes entered into the door lock and figuring it out! Thankfully someone found them about 30 minutes later and they were returned. The codes were changed, but if they did it once, they could do it again! My mother's place used a key fob, so that wasn't likely to happen, unless some dumb staff person left it lying around.

It is a little easier if there's no car, but when there's a spouse who can still safely drive, a car will be a necessity, unless there are alternate methods of transportation. IF a car is needed, you WILL have to ensure it is disabled when you aren't using it.

We never got any doctor support for eliminating driving with mom. A doctor's handwritten note on a scrap of paper saying it isn't safe for you to drive won't cut it! She was never taken for a test, the DMV was never notified. Her license was still "good" for about 2 more years, I just let it expire. YB had the "talk" and took the key (I was there, but said nothing until we left the condo - I suggested he disable it as I was sure she had another key.) Next day, who gets the nasty call? Me of course! Nope, never touched your key! Day two, nastier call to get down there and fix whatever I did to the car! Nope, never touched it. Bottom line is there WAS another key and she managed to find it, and attempted to go someplace. Later we removed the car from the premises and sold it. She'd periodically whine about it, saying she doesn't go far. This was true, her "circle of comfort" had been reduced considerably, but that wasn't the point! A 90+ yo with limited hearing, Mac Deg, and dementia driving an 8 cylinder behemoth was a disaster waiting to happen. I just told her I didn't care if she went 2 feet, because if she hits someone, she could end up losing everything!

Others will say Oh, it's their property, you can't do that legally! I'll deal with the legal first vs dealing with the disaster she's likely to create.

She would sometimes say the worst thing to happen was losing her "wheels." Eventually that morphed into the worst thing she did was give up her "wheels", like it was HER idea! Even later, the topic stopped coming up.

Easiest method: get a doc note and disable the car. If he insists on a test, you can try it, but seems like a waste of money (usually there is a fee - nothing in life is generally free!)

I don't know what age this person is but the Drs know and shouldn't be asking for your permission. They should be stating the facts to the patient in their best interest. My mother(86) was told truthfully that at her age she probably wouldn't survive an accident. Could be a slight accident but if the airbag is deployed it could crush her frail body. She too, felt she could pass the test. We went online for just a practice version and she failed. She tried again, no. I think this gave her something to think about and she didn't press the issue any further. On the road many feel confident that they're good drivers but you can't control the ones who are not. The main question is how the condition of vehicle is? Dents, dings and scrapes are the definitive sign that there's a driving impairment.
Try the free trial test online before forking out big bucks.
Wish you well.

In the meantime, requiring more and more tests, re-evaluations, and delaying DMV permissions to drive allows the necessary time to pass by so the driver will realize themselves it is time to stop driving.

Trust that the DMV knows a little something about this, and will likely put more obstacles in the way of a barely competent driver.

I supported a friend through this process, thinking she could still drive.
In the final test not passed, friend was allowed her dignity and said she decided to sell her car.

Not being able to drive anymore is bad enough, but if family comes against you and causes a loss of dignity, that is the worst! imo.

My mom did the driving evaluation. But it didnt really solve anything because she didnt believe them when she didnt pass. They did some cognitive stuff and reaction type stuff prior to the driving also. This was a place that evaluated seniors and also others that have had injuries after rehab to be cleared to drive. Mom showtimed with the best of them, so I did "load the dice" so to speak. I deliberately scheduled the appointment for later in the afternoon, when I knew she usually had more issues. But it was obvious to the examiner anyway. She couldnt follow multi step instructions like go two blocks and turn left. Drifted in the lane. And also slow reaction time.
But it was somewhat easier as she didnt have her car with her in town with me. It simply is being " taken care of" by my sister.
She still thinks she can drive but as she is now in memory care I dont have to worry about it anymore. Her car has been given to her soon to be 16 year kld grandson, which is what she said ahe would do if she couldnt drive pre dementia.

Have the DR report DH to DMV with his dx of Alzheimer's. It might be the easiest route and then blame the DR for his nondriving status.

Because of my father's passive/aggressive behavior mom wouldn't confront dad about driving. For months I'd ask dad not to drive. Please stop driving. FINALLY he agreed but before I got the car disposed of ... yup he drove. We were talking of parking it far away in the lower parking lot of the facility but got it donated and it finally got towed off.

Of course this wasn't the end of it. For the next couple years he'd bring up he was perfectly capable of driving. He made the mistake of complaining to his DR and she replied with 6 words: "Richard, we talked about your driving."

For some elders if is very hard to give up driving - it's one more loss; loss of independence.

Good luck.