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I’ve seen the letter opener and Christmas ball-like items, bearing the charity’s name, on her table. She tells me a rep stops by her house with the items.
Mentioned this at my caregiver’s support group of 14. Got deer-in-the-headlight looks . . .
My philosophy, I only donate to local charities. I do nothing over the phone. I don't do Go Fund Me either. So, hopefully this carries over if I ever suffer from Dementia.
If you can, block all numbers on Moms phone that have nothing to do with family. If ur Moms POA, you could have asked them to stop the calls, the mailings and the visits. If they don't u will go to the FCC to start.
These Charities are getting out of hand. This includes Churches. Check Moms Credit Cards and see if money is being taken out automatically. If you have POA u need to get the doctor to declare her incompetent to handle her affairs. Then call her CC companies and have her accts frozen. Her bank accts only you can sign as POA.
She writes a check each month to them. So these pieces of xxxx send a ‘thank you’ statement ALONG WITH a suggested donation amount over and above what the receipt is for, along with an envelope to send another donation in.
Have POA. Neuro follow up mid-January. Pushing for whatever tests need to be done for a diagnosis at that time.
Not sure why I haven't seen the updates until the latest post showed up today, but...
I noted how some of your mom's behaviors were similar to my mother's. This one brought back memories too:
"She drove through a huge pot hole, blowing out the tire and driving on the rim to get to her restaurant (instead of pulling over immediately)."
After a call telling me she had a flat tire, I brought my portable pump to fill it and see if it needed a plug or something. I get there and stood for several minutes marveling over the tire, split open from the rim to the ground, the metal trim around the wheel well pulled half off and bent. I got AAA to remove it and put the spare on and my mechanic said the rim was ruined, so who knows how far she drove on that or what she hit!
Typical answer would be "it was fine when she was driving it." That's when I consulted with YB and said it's time to take this tank away (8 cylinder Grand Marquis - typical old people car!) Previously we found the back of the driver side mirror was gone (there last time I drove it!), expired inspection sticker and white stripes on both front fenders, from "brushing" the garage door trim. He did all the talking and took the key, and I had him disable the car as I knew she had another key. Sure enough, next day I get a call demanding her key back, which I never touched and told her so. Second day I get a nastier call demanding I get down there and fix what I did to her car (clearly she found that key!), to which I could honestly reply that I didn't touch her car. She moaned and whined about it for a long time, but eventually that morphed into the worst decision she made was to give up her 'wheels.' Believe whatever you want mom, so long as I don't get the blame!!!
Hoping you get all you need to step in and take over. If she is currently only writing checks and you can remove access, that will stop the donations!
IF at all possible have your/her lawyer determine if she is competent enough to update her will, even if it is just to add a few words, no real changes - if there is a new one on file, any will this >ahem< charity might have conned her into signing would be null and void as the newer one would take precedence. Don't tell them you are doing this!!
As for lighting and cameras, can hubby not install them when she is not home (aka you take her to appointment, he installs?) If she notices, tell her the "friends" at the charity must have done it!!! :-D
Yes, Mom blamed the fact that the roads are soo bad here (which they are), but no need to keep driving on a blown tire when lots of opportunity to pull off and get help! Just bad decision making, continually . . .
Wednesday was neuro doc follow-up appt. after her stint in the ER in Nov. (Didn’t take meds at night cause she was getting home late and didn’t know if taking it too late would interfere with morning pill - so she stopped taking dinner pill. Never mind finding out from pharmacy or doc if this was a good idea . . . .)
Mom told me I wasn’t welcome to go back with her and the doc, but could after she spoke to him. [Almost lost it right then and there.] By the time I was ushered back, it was clear there had been a love fest going on because, according to the doc, she’s such a ‘lovely woman’. Ugh, yeah, to strangers. To me - not so much. Doc apparently didn’t take time to review her info - he didn’t remember it was HE, in the hospital, who TOLD her not to drive and discharged her with script for a driver eval. No mention of returning her keys, but to visit any driver testing facility for an eval.
Last night, Mom leaves a message saying she expects me to return her car keys and bring them to her house today. SHE WAS RIGHT THERE IN FRONT OF THE DOC when he spoke about the driving eval. I don’t know why she would think I’d give her keys back - she hasn’t taken the eval!
Someone on this site said “As long as we're acting in their best interest to keep them safe, using the word No becomes imperative for all involved.”
So nothing has changed. The PCP passed on making any decisions and said to visit the neuro. Neuro couldn’t even remember it was HE who told Mom not to drive . . . He’s not running any further tests. Back to same situation as prior to her November stint in ER. And I’m going out of town for a few weeks.
I’ve called the local office on aging, left a message and awaiting their call to explore possible exploitation on the part of this charity.
{ Love your comment about the camera installer from the charity!!!! }. Thank you for the laugh!!
Katsmihur: For some reason, I am just now seeing your October post. I read your update to disgusted and am very sorry that not much has changed for the better. Prayers sent to you tonight.💞
Thank you so much for the prayers - lots of people who know Mom and I are doing the same! God has brought me to this place as a reminder it’s all in His hands. I only do what I can . . .
Calling Mom with response: “No, Mom, I cannot possibly return your car keys. Discharge papers included driver’s eval script. I’m available to take you on xxxday.”
It is hard, but it usually gets easier with use and practice. No. No. No. No. I was lucky that brother took the keys and did the suggested disabling, then I could honestly say I didn't touch the keys or the car. Wasn't about to say either was my idea! But, clearly your mom has dementia at some level. YB sat in front of her and did all the talking. I stood in the background and said NOTHING. But, next day and day after, who gets the phone calls? ME! But, it worked out well that I could pass the buck (didn't say who, what, when, where or how, just said 'twasnt me!) She actually did ask me who took the key when I said I didn't touch it. My reply was 'You're so smart, you figure it out!' and then hung up the phone. Must've taken a long time to find that second key, as the next call didn't come until the next morning (she already had stopped driving at night, so if she found it late, she wouldn't try to drive until the next morning.)
You have the doc note/order for eval - blame gets laid on him, you are just following doctor's orders mom! If you have a date set, you drive there and hope the test isn't on the road! Get copies of anything that says she isn't allowed to drive and make copies. You'll be having to leave a copy with her often, as a reminder, every time she brings up the car. If she's that much like my mother, she'll throw it away!
"Mom told me I wasn’t welcome to go back with her and the doc, but could after she spoke to him. [Almost lost it right then and there.] By the time I was ushered back, it was clear there had been a love fest going on because, according to the doc, she’s such a ‘lovely woman’. Ugh, yeah, to strangers. To me - not so much."
Slight variation in the theme! Last time we saw her regular doc (been a while, but I think I requested they eval/write a letter), she was okay with me being in the room. When the tech came in to run some tests, she got all nasty and I finally exited the room. Doc happened to be outside at the nurse station, and saw this bothered me, so he chatted with me. He did say he would provide the letter I needed (mainly for her pension, which was dad's and is federal, so special hoops and hurdles to negotiate - POAs NFG.) Nine months and many portal messages later, no letter. Calling was a joke - you'd either get in an endless menu loop or voicemail. They would ask for POA doc - I already SENT that to you! Then they wanted to know what was needed in the letter and to see the request - now that I type this, yes, I HAD sent this to them to ask for it and that's why the appt was set up!! You HAVE the damn letter and what is needed in the papers I sent MONTHS ago, but here they are again, attached to my reply. Still nothing. Funny it has been YEARS now (3) and I was getting emails and calls about her portal, needing to come in, etc. I called the "help" desk, after getting the PW and username reset because I didn't have it documented anymore and had them disable the thing!
At that point, we were on the cusp of "the move", which was not close to that doc and we took her to mine. THAT was not fun - doc made the mistake of saying 'It's not safe for you to live alone.' We're lucky WWIII didn't happen!!
It still took several more letters to get the right magic words! Her pension and SS are direct deposit, YB and I are POA and are on the account, but in order to change either address, the hurdles had to be cleared for both! I needed the address for documents, like tax statements, to be changed and phone access if changes were needed. Eventually we were going to rent or sell the place and federal mail can't be forwarded. MC is fully deductible, so I needed to change her withholding to no tax status (cost is covered by pension, SS and monthly trust deposits, so it exceeds her regular income!)
I am hoping you have the POAs set up and can take over the finances for her and block the charity's access to her or at least her money and home/assets. If she insists on "managing" her account, get her phony checks online and phony stamps to mail her "payments." It would be amusing to see what they would do with her funny money checks! If no POA, EC atty might be able to assist you. In the meantime, call the local SS office and set up an appointment to become rep payee. It will require a special account that only you can access, but it would keep everyone's mitts off mom's money! WARNING - when you apply, notice will be sent to you AND to her. If you can temporarily forward her mail to a PO box or have it held for you to pickup, she doesn't really need to see this - it'll just open a can of worms you don't need! Mom's did go to the MC facility, but after handing her a bill from OmniCare (which we didn't ask for their meds!!!) she got really upset, so they didn't give her any mail after that.
If you have access to mom's account, have her mail temp forwarded to you and contact all the billing companies and have just the billing address changed to your address. Leave her name and service address as is. Then use the bill payer system to add them all and pay her bills that way. If she doesn't get any bills in the mail, she will likely forget about them. Most don't care where the bills go, so long as they get paid. Some use auto-pay, I prefer to "manage" it myself.
WOW, I’m sorry you’ve had to spend so much time getting the right paperwork, but I do hear what you’re saying. I’ve kept a good record of all the changes in Mom, her shortness with family and withdrawing from all conversation with us. Between two PCPs and the neuro from her ER stint - I can’t tell you how much paperwork and phone calls I’ve made, too. It’s unreal, isn’t it??
I do have POA, but it’s not in effect. Psych visit in hospital notes mild neurocognitive impairment. She does NOT want me involved with her finances & resisted giving monthly expenses so I could submit the hospital’s financial assistance application (that the social worker GAVE to her in the hospital). I contacted them & they understand what I’m up against.... Don’t think I can redirect her mail to me or place it on a hold - she won’t agree to that, lol.
Final thoughts - from what you described about the doc appts, it doesn't sound like they did much for you. In some cases, you need doctor documentation to determine competence (we of course see the LO often, so WE know better, they don't!)
If they haven't given you what you need, would it be possible to find another doctor? Although mom might be "doctored out", perhaps if she fails the driving eval you could use a new doc as an excuse to work around this? Just thinking on the fly here, which is something we often have to do when dealing with dementia (and idiots!)
The person who summed it all up for us (more for bro than me, I was already aware enough) was the nurse sent by the aide company we were considering to test mom. It was clear to her that mom had dementia and suggested we get a locked timed pill dispenser. This was covered by Medicare BTW, as were some follow up visits. This might be doable after the eval - call it a follow up eval!
A response you got from some attorney bothers me - he didn't suggest making a will change with mom? Telling you to call them and say you are POA doesn't do squat. She might be competent enough in an attorney's eyes to sign a simple change to the will, which would make it the most recent and override anything those scumbags might have done. I would ask him/her if this could be done - if they say no because she isn't competent, try someone else. At the least that atty could have offered to contact the charity with a cease and desist letter or call... Isn't this why they get the big bucks?
Correct - two PCPs and neuro really did nothing to address MCD. Unfortunately, she thinks everything is honkey-dorey, but I’ll keep reminding her they are not. Mom will NOT go for a second opinion, at my suggestion, for sure! I cannot imagine she’ll pass the road test, so maybe she’ll want to go to another doc - I don’t know.
Our power went out for a while and know that Mom’s area goes out frequently, too. Made the call and of course she didn’t pick up the phone so I left a message saying I hope her power was not out, that it wouldn’t be possible for me to return her car keys and that I’m happy to take her to the driver eval. Wonder when I’ll hear from her?
"Our power went out for a while and know that Mom’s area goes out frequently, "
Can mom even answer the phone with the power out?. If a cell phone they would ring, but not a portable phone that has a base station wired to a land line. So many people have gotten rid of land lines. I am one.
Thanks. Mom does not have a cell, but landline. She never picks up the phone until she hears who is calling and decides then whether to pick it up, depending on who it is.
I was able to leave my message on her machine. No communication back from her yet.
Mom diagnosed with MCD in the hospital, was told no driving until passing driver’s eval/test and given a script to do so. Doc/hospital should have put through paperwork to the state to suspend license, correct?
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I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
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APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
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You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
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Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
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If you can, block all numbers on Moms phone that have nothing to do with family. If ur Moms POA, you could have asked them to stop the calls, the mailings and the visits. If they don't u will go to the FCC to start.
These Charities are getting out of hand. This includes Churches. Check Moms Credit Cards and see if money is being taken out automatically. If you have POA u need to get the doctor to declare her incompetent to handle her affairs. Then call her CC companies and have her accts frozen. Her bank accts only you can sign as POA.
She writes a check each month to them. So these pieces of xxxx send a ‘thank you’ statement ALONG WITH a suggested donation amount over and above what the receipt is for, along with an envelope to send another donation in.
Have POA. Neuro follow up mid-January. Pushing for whatever tests need to be done for a diagnosis at that time.
I noted how some of your mom's behaviors were similar to my mother's. This one brought back memories too:
"She drove through a huge pot hole, blowing out the tire and driving on the rim to get to her restaurant (instead of pulling over immediately)."
After a call telling me she had a flat tire, I brought my portable pump to fill it and see if it needed a plug or something. I get there and stood for several minutes marveling over the tire, split open from the rim to the ground, the metal trim around the wheel well pulled half off and bent. I got AAA to remove it and put the spare on and my mechanic said the rim was ruined, so who knows how far she drove on that or what she hit!
Typical answer would be "it was fine when she was driving it." That's when I consulted with YB and said it's time to take this tank away (8 cylinder Grand Marquis - typical old people car!) Previously we found the back of the driver side mirror was gone (there last time I drove it!), expired inspection sticker and white stripes on both front fenders, from "brushing" the garage door trim. He did all the talking and took the key, and I had him disable the car as I knew she had another key. Sure enough, next day I get a call demanding her key back, which I never touched and told her so. Second day I get a nastier call demanding I get down there and fix what I did to her car (clearly she found that key!), to which I could honestly reply that I didn't touch her car. She moaned and whined about it for a long time, but eventually that morphed into the worst decision she made was to give up her 'wheels.' Believe whatever you want mom, so long as I don't get the blame!!!
Hoping you get all you need to step in and take over. If she is currently only writing checks and you can remove access, that will stop the donations!
IF at all possible have your/her lawyer determine if she is competent enough to update her will, even if it is just to add a few words, no real changes - if there is a new one on file, any will this >ahem< charity might have conned her into signing would be null and void as the newer one would take precedence. Don't tell them you are doing this!!
As for lighting and cameras, can hubby not install them when she is not home (aka you take her to appointment, he installs?) If she notices, tell her the "friends" at the charity must have done it!!! :-D
Yes, Mom blamed the fact that the roads are soo bad here (which they are), but no need to keep driving on a blown tire when lots of opportunity to pull off and get help! Just bad decision making, continually . . .
Wednesday was neuro doc follow-up appt. after her stint in the ER in Nov. (Didn’t take meds at night cause she was getting home late and didn’t know if taking it too late would interfere with morning pill - so she stopped taking dinner pill. Never mind finding out from pharmacy or doc if this was a good idea . . . .)
Mom told me I wasn’t welcome to go back with her and the doc, but could after she spoke to him. [Almost lost it right then and there.] By the time I was ushered back, it was clear there had been a love fest going on because, according to the doc, she’s such a ‘lovely woman’. Ugh, yeah, to strangers. To me - not so much. Doc apparently didn’t take time to review her info - he didn’t remember it was HE, in the hospital, who TOLD her not to drive and discharged her with script for a driver eval. No mention of returning her keys, but to visit any driver testing facility for an eval.
Last night, Mom leaves a message saying she expects me to return her car keys and bring them to her house today. SHE WAS RIGHT THERE IN FRONT OF THE DOC when he spoke about the driving eval. I don’t know why she would think I’d give her keys back - she hasn’t taken the eval!
Someone on this site said “As long as we're acting in their best interest to keep them safe, using the word No becomes imperative for all involved.”
So nothing has changed. The PCP passed on making any decisions and said to visit the neuro. Neuro couldn’t even remember it was HE who told Mom not to drive . . . He’s not running any further tests. Back to same situation as prior to her November stint in ER. And I’m going out of town for a few weeks.
I’ve called the local office on aging, left a message and awaiting their call to explore possible exploitation on the part of this charity.
{ Love your comment about the camera installer from the charity!!!! }. Thank you for the laugh!!
Calling Mom with response: “No, Mom, I cannot possibly return your car keys. Discharge papers included driver’s eval script. I’m available to take you on xxxday.”
You have the doc note/order for eval - blame gets laid on him, you are just following doctor's orders mom! If you have a date set, you drive there and hope the test isn't on the road! Get copies of anything that says she isn't allowed to drive and make copies. You'll be having to leave a copy with her often, as a reminder, every time she brings up the car. If she's that much like my mother, she'll throw it away!
Why didn’t I think of this???? Thank you!
Slight variation in the theme! Last time we saw her regular doc (been a while, but I think I requested they eval/write a letter), she was okay with me being in the room. When the tech came in to run some tests, she got all nasty and I finally exited the room. Doc happened to be outside at the nurse station, and saw this bothered me, so he chatted with me. He did say he would provide the letter I needed (mainly for her pension, which was dad's and is federal, so special hoops and hurdles to negotiate - POAs NFG.) Nine months and many portal messages later, no letter. Calling was a joke - you'd either get in an endless menu loop or voicemail. They would ask for POA doc - I already SENT that to you! Then they wanted to know what was needed in the letter and to see the request - now that I type this, yes, I HAD sent this to them to ask for it and that's why the appt was set up!! You HAVE the damn letter and what is needed in the papers I sent MONTHS ago, but here they are again, attached to my reply. Still nothing. Funny it has been YEARS now (3) and I was getting emails and calls about her portal, needing to come in, etc. I called the "help" desk, after getting the PW and username reset because I didn't have it documented anymore and had them disable the thing!
At that point, we were on the cusp of "the move", which was not close to that doc and we took her to mine. THAT was not fun - doc made the mistake of saying 'It's not safe for you to live alone.' We're lucky WWIII didn't happen!!
It still took several more letters to get the right magic words! Her pension and SS are direct deposit, YB and I are POA and are on the account, but in order to change either address, the hurdles had to be cleared for both! I needed the address for documents, like tax statements, to be changed and phone access if changes were needed. Eventually we were going to rent or sell the place and federal mail can't be forwarded. MC is fully deductible, so I needed to change her withholding to no tax status (cost is covered by pension, SS and monthly trust deposits, so it exceeds her regular income!)
I am hoping you have the POAs set up and can take over the finances for her and block the charity's access to her or at least her money and home/assets. If she insists on "managing" her account, get her phony checks online and phony stamps to mail her "payments." It would be amusing to see what they would do with her funny money checks! If no POA, EC atty might be able to assist you. In the meantime, call the local SS office and set up an appointment to become rep payee. It will require a special account that only you can access, but it would keep everyone's mitts off mom's money! WARNING - when you apply, notice will be sent to you AND to her. If you can temporarily forward her mail to a PO box or have it held for you to pickup, she doesn't really need to see this - it'll just open a can of worms you don't need! Mom's did go to the MC facility, but after handing her a bill from OmniCare (which we didn't ask for their meds!!!) she got really upset, so they didn't give her any mail after that.
If you have access to mom's account, have her mail temp forwarded to you and contact all the billing companies and have just the billing address changed to your address. Leave her name and service address as is. Then use the bill payer system to add them all and pay her bills that way. If she doesn't get any bills in the mail, she will likely forget about them. Most don't care where the bills go, so long as they get paid. Some use auto-pay, I prefer to "manage" it myself.
I do have POA, but it’s not in effect. Psych visit in hospital notes mild neurocognitive impairment. She does NOT want me involved with her finances & resisted giving monthly expenses so I could submit the hospital’s financial assistance application (that the social worker GAVE to her in the hospital). I contacted them & they understand what I’m up against.... Don’t think I can redirect her mail to me or place it on a hold - she won’t agree to that, lol.
Appreciate your thoughts!
If they haven't given you what you need, would it be possible to find another doctor? Although mom might be "doctored out", perhaps if she fails the driving eval you could use a new doc as an excuse to work around this? Just thinking on the fly here, which is something we often have to do when dealing with dementia (and idiots!)
The person who summed it all up for us (more for bro than me, I was already aware enough) was the nurse sent by the aide company we were considering to test mom. It was clear to her that mom had dementia and suggested we get a locked timed pill dispenser. This was covered by Medicare BTW, as were some follow up visits. This might be doable after the eval - call it a follow up eval!
A response you got from some attorney bothers me - he didn't suggest making a will change with mom? Telling you to call them and say you are POA doesn't do squat. She might be competent enough in an attorney's eyes to sign a simple change to the will, which would make it the most recent and override anything those scumbags might have done. I would ask him/her if this could be done - if they say no because she isn't competent, try someone else. At the least that atty could have offered to contact the charity with a cease and desist letter or call... Isn't this why they get the big bucks?
Our power went out for a while and know that Mom’s area goes out frequently, too. Made the call and of course she didn’t pick up the phone so I left a message saying I hope her power was not out, that it wouldn’t be possible for me to return her car keys and that I’m happy to take her to the driver eval. Wonder when I’ll hear from her?
Can mom even answer the phone with the power out?. If a cell phone they would ring, but not a portable phone that has a base station wired to a land line. So many people have gotten rid of land lines. I am one.
I was able to leave my message on her machine. No communication back from her yet.