Has anyone experienced being in the sandwich generation?

Great advice for us all, Veronica.

I think that TG thinks that by giving and giving to his father and to his daughter, he is earning their love. It ain't working.

Cloth diapers - I remember those when I first began working as a babysitter. Thought nothing of it at the time as it was standard. I can't help thinking of the contribution to waste now from the disposable diapers which as I understand are not biodegradeable. Probably much more sanitary for the person who changes the diapers though.

Veronica, you raise very good, insightful and practical points. The widespread use of credit cards has enabled us to live a higher and more comfortable lifestyle than might otherwise be practical w/o those little plastic cards.

The bread lines my father stood in during the Great Depression would no longer be necessary as there's always the credit card, and there are support nets which didn't exist then. I'm not saying people of lower income don't have challenges; they most certainly do.

When I see a few commercials on tv before I can switch the channel, they're so heavily oriented toward consumer goods that aren't really necessary, and I always wonder whether they really enhance someone's life. They certainly can enhance the bottom line of the manufacturers and marketers.

The little speech enabled machines that are being advertised, and from a few comments here and there, are apparently actually being bought and used. I am at a complete loss to understand the need or desire for these Google answering robots.

Why would I need to ask a machine what the temp is? I look at a thermometer outside, watch the activity (or nonactivity) of the local critters. There are plenty of ways to rely on oneself to get the information these things provide. And, frankly, I wouldn't rely on everything a machine would pronounce as I've found that search engines (one in particular) produce results in a sometimes a random pattern, perhaps dependent on the source's payments to be priority hits.

This reliance on machines and techno gadgets is I think a major shift away from self reliance. Perhaps that's why so many of these survival programs are popping up like weeds in spring. I think there's a tremendous accomplishment in being adaptable, in developing solutions and implementing them, as opposed to just pulling out the credit card and buying something.

One local lake is always host to perhaps a dozen ice shanties, every winter. And evryr winter there are people out there ice fishing. My father taught us how to do that when we were children. I remember being cold, but the outdoor air was good for us.

It's this adaptability that I think provides a stronger self reliance and ability to handle challenges, problems and changes, because we have to look to ourselves instead of to store shelves. I think that flexibility is being lost as people turn to reliance on gadgets and machines.

And I'm not talking about washing machines, stoves, even microwaves. They're wonderful inventions. But so are sewing machines, and they're literally "force multipliers", to borrow from a military expression.

TG, I think Barb hit on a weakness of your SIL. Perhaps he's just not adapted to self support, but perhaps he also doesn't even have to try if he's got someone to rely on. (Maybe you can get him on a survival program and he'll learn to grow up!)

I think the self survival and self supporting attitude is one of the reasons my father is still strong at 98, and still wants to do things he shouldn't do. He's never given up. (Me, on the other hand...well, I'm ready for some nice needed rest.)

I am all for saving money. I do OK between my wife and I, we are able to drive late model cars (one 10 years old and one 1 year), we have a nice place but that is with saving. planning and living in a small place for many years while the kids grew up. They shared a room and it didn't kill them. I save by using a lot of coupons. I am always buying on sale, if I cant get it with a coupon I generally don't buy it. My kids are pretty much the same I think.
It is just hard when people assume you have lots of disposable money. Leave the doors open, all the lights on, the AC etc.... It all costs money in the end. I don't at least I think I don't have a bucket of cash lying around. I work enough to make money to do the things I can, I work many ways to scare up cash, I even plow snow a few driveways to help pay for my new plow on my truck vs just plowing my own driveway. I wish I could get that through my SIL's head. Instead of sitting around all week (works 36 full time hours over the weekend).
Get a PT job and put some serious cash in your pocket. He says he will get a PT job after the holidays (hiring then).
Last night Dad told my wife about a cashmere sweater he wants for Christmas. Great a week before and you want cashmere?.......... Really? What is next? I don't buy cashmere for me. Seriously, where does this come from?

So your dad wants cashmere, I want a new sofa bed but that ain't gonna happen either ;)

TG, "where does it come from?" I think you know the answer to that. These people have been enabled; it comes from being able to get away with sponging off you.

TG, your dad is a narcissist. Sounds as though he always has been. You are a people pleaser.

The old man with no money, living off his son, wants a CASHMERE SWEATER???? Yeah, he will be styling in that, watching Judge Judy all afternoon.

TG - glad you went out with your wife and talked about other things. You won't get anything into his head talking to him. But if you change your tactics, he may change in response. He seriously needs limits in terms of the perks he is getting at your place. He needs, for his own emotional maturity, to take more responsibility for himself and his wife, your daughter and to take less advantage of you. That requires you to change in your behaviours towards him. As long as he is allowed to leech off you, he has no reason to change.

So your father wants a cashmere sweater. Fine, but that does not mean you have to give it to him. At one point my mother wanted $1000 each from my sis and myself to help her pay for her drugs, which in fact, she could afford herself. It was strictly a manipulation. My sis, who is codependent, gave it to her. I didn't. Meanwhile I have spent more than that in her care, according to my choices and priorities. What you give to your father is your choice. I hope it is a wise one.

TG - you're in US, if you want to get dad a cashmere sweater at discount price, search "5 Top Online Consignment Stores" for a news article that runs down some of my new fave shopping spots for deep discounts on gently used clothing. ThredUp and Swap are my 2 personal faves. He didn't say NEW cashmere sweater, did he? lol Good luck.

The cashmere sweater comments reminded me of a song Janis Joplin sang:

"Oh Lord, won't you buy me a Mercedes Benz?
My friends all drive Porsches, I must make amends.
Worked hard all my lifetime, no help from my friends,
So Lord, won't you buy me a Mercedes Benz?

Oh Lord, won't you buy me a color TV?
Dialing For Dollars is trying to find me.
I wait for delivery each day until three,
So oh Lord, won't you buy me a color TV?"

....and more requests for freebies.

Thrift stores often have cashmere sweaters. A new, quality cashmere sweater runs $300. That's an insane gift to give someone when money is tight.

Went to the mall to look for a sweater for dad, ran out, sensory over load for me. Tried it last year the same. Smells, noise, lights! Heart rate went up, BP up, light headed! Put me in a damper of a mood. This is why I am not a big fan of the shopping for the holiday. Spend to spend. I went to the jewelry store last week. My wife wants for nothing, cant buy her anything, she is wonderful! Brought up in a frugal house, so she is terrible to buy for. Not much for jewelry except what I buy her. So I made her go to the jeweler and and get me a list of what she wanted. We had looked to replace the ring I gave her on our 5th anniversary. So she picked something very nice. I went last week and got her a very nice ring I have been wanting to buy. Took 25 years to get her the nice engagement ring to replace the sliver of a diamond I gave her when we got married. So I was excited to get her this to compliment her that ring. That is what I like to do, not just to have to buy something for the sake of buying, buy something for someone that appreciates it.
Went out to dinner last night, left the others on their own, SIL made dinner, woo hoo! good for them. Going out again tonight, need a break.
Just cant go looking for something just to buy it. I shop too much as it is for the household things let alone look for a specific type and color of sweater. Gift card that should do it, Tired of the holiday already and it isn't even here yet.
Bought dad the fixins for making his candy, Has he started it yet? No...... not going to do it for him.... He has all day but he needs to do it with someone so he can take the credit.Ugh! The holidays.
Merry Christmas to all and Happy Hanukkah (my brother converted 15 years ago)... Yes I have a mixed bag of nuts for a family, who doesn't? I also have more steps than a haunted house too....... Long, long story.....

To all of the caregivers a belated Merry Christmas. Survived another holiday, no melt downs, very peaceful.
I hope all of yours were well and you enjoyed your holiday!

Same to you TG. Glad yours was peaceful. May that continue into the new year. It was good here too

Peaceful right now, Everyone is at work, daughter went back to the city, SIL and daughter are at work and dad is visiting relatives for the week. So nice to have my house back even if it is for a few days. Dinners have been nice, able to talk without comments. Amazing when the cast of characters are out how calming it gets around here, even the dogs are chill! Working on getting our addition done. Feeling good for a few minutes!

So we all have been trying to keep a level in the house. In some was it has been getting better. The temporary has an open time line so who knows when it will change. I ask and there is no answer. I get upset when the garage door is left open (just off my basement office) my office has been 64 degrees this week, lights left on. It gets old complaining about it.
So yesterday, dad was to be out for the evening and the kids said they were doing something different for dinner. "Yea", I thought" quiet time for me and the Mrs. After lunch I smell and hear cooking in the kitchen. I say "I thought you two were going out to dinner"? Then SIL tells me he is making dinner for my daughter, Date night, going out is too expensive"....... "Oh" I am thinking, he is making this big dinner for just the two of them. So I give it some time to sink in. Wait I thought, now I have to share the kitchen and have 2 separate dinners going on at the same time? I cook every night for everyone not just my wife and I. I was hopeful that he would have made enough for 4 and eat separately but no. So my wife comes home and we talk about it. I get more and more ramped up. We have to eat in the dining room or worse they eat in their room? (No food in bedrooms unless you are sick is my rule). So now I have to go out to dinner? I was pretty upset in the fact I buy the food (He did buy this meals food) but I cook every night and when he doesn't get home in time there is always food left for him. It took a couple beverages to cool me down. I am more hurt by anything. I provide, I bend over, I pay. As I always say no good deed goes unpunished. So how to I do dinners now? Just cook for me and my wife and my dad?
I'm tired, I am beaten, I am exhausted. I am here 24/7 working and dealing with dogs, doors, and issues. Am I being too judgemental? It is awkward on my part. No one sees it. I am trying to be the good person and look the other way. Every time I ask about them looking for a place there is always someone else s who gets in the way. I didn't raise my kids this way. One is on her own and paying all her own bills (except cell phone). I just don't get it. Everyone looks to me to bail them out house wise, money wise. I am tired, just tired. And dad keeps going out the eat and by the end of the month I have to give him money, still haven't been paid since the November trip...... That was his Christmas gift as I see it........... Not even a card to us or the kids. Am I just being picky?

STOP ENABLING THEM!!!!!!!!!!! Give your daughter and son-in-law a deadline - if they are working they can afford something - even if it is a dump. Stop giving your dad money - if he is out by end of month - then he waits until the beginning of the next month.

You complain but let these people treat you this way - you are teaching them that this is OK to treat you this way. So stop.

I know, I feel like I enable them. Trying to do the right thing just kicks me in teh butt. Dad asked this AM if I was mad at him. I told him I work at 4 different jobs to bring money in to keep this place afloat. Nothing but crickets..... I told him I was stressed. We put a sign up close the garage door, he asked if he left it open, My response was it doesn't leave itself open..... Really, they don't listen to themselves. Time to stop providing.

tgengine, Not sure if you are still on the grid or if you cut yourself loose.
A bit hallucinating reading through all the good advice given to you 8-10 months ago - and a lot of it was really good advice - so I'm wondering how things are now.


Did everything get sorted out for the better? If so, congratulations!
If everything is more or less the same, I believe your wife would like it a lot if you could be in a good mood all the time, which means eliminating all the things that make you angry. Then she will be happy. I think she would also like the house to herself, or maybe share moments just with her daughter.
In none of your posts above did you mention what your wife was doing to get daughter and SIL out of the house; in the end, maybe it's only the SIL and your dad who she would like to see depart.
In your place, I would just start turning off the taps.
No more cash for your dad, no more baking or sweetmaking for other people at your home - but he can do this at your local church or in a group of people to keep him company.
No more cash to the SIL. Anything he and your daughter need as a couple should go into her hands only. Push SIL out to live elsewhere even if your daughter stays with mum.
Replace your current garage door with one that will close automatically after 5 minutes if sensor beam is not broken by human movement.
Set up an outside enclosure with paddling pool for the dogs to romp in summer, and dog gates to restrict dogs roaming indoors.
Put up smoke alarms everywhere just above where anybody might smoke. You can always set off an alarm intentionally every time you catch a person indoors with a cigarette. They are excruciatingly noisy!!
Keep your wife on your side, regain full use of your home.
Consign the rest of the world to perdition, sit back and enjoy a beer.

Your daughter and SIL are moochers. And they will drain the life out of you. Furthermore, your Dad needs to move into either an Assisted Kiving place, or a nursing home, or a seniors place. Give yourself the luxury of being a human being. I wouldn't leave my own home in order to be happy. It' s defesting the purpose of owning a home! Send them all packing. You paid for your place, so move them out. All of them. Enjoy your life while you still have one. Their dog peed on the carpet? They can oay for new carpeting or the cleaning... They're broke? Too bad. They can sign an agreement to oay for the car. Or I'd take back my keys. Life isn't fair. Poor babies. Make them act their age.

Stop being the martyr. You are reaping exactly ehat you've sewn...

Tg, you say your dad can't live on his own, he has no money. Does your dad get $700 a month? Then he can live on his own. My dad gets SS, a little VA, and SSI, which all combine to the U.S. gov't minimum income for elders of $700. He rents a HUD senior apartment which costs approximately 30% of his income. He gets SNAP benefits. He has extra cash left over every month. Make your dad pay his own way. If he is not mentally incompetent, then he can be on his own.

My dad's competency is questionable, but he is doing just fine living on his own, with some minimal oversight and help.  

Ive been there! I had to go the tough love route! Its harsh and it tears your heart BUT its for the best.

Give them 1 warning! Go down and file an order and tell them if they dont move out in 24 hours they will be thrown out by the police. (Watch the look on thier face, its priceless)
I wasnt believed so I made the phone call, cops came, they got 15 minutes to get their stuff and GET OUT!

Oh it still gets thrown in my face but my sanity was still in tact and my house was quiet afterwards. No more fighting over coming in at all hours, on the phone all night, high bills because SOME people would turn the air down to 70 bills were 350 and 400 a month and our house doesnt have an upstairs! Was just too much! I worried if they would be ok BUT they were old enough to be on their own. They found their way because they didnt have a crutch....ME and MY house and MY money!

When you enable people they will take advantage to the fullest until you SHOW THEM they HAVE TO do it on their own!

Probably not a popular answer but it kept my marraige together and me from losing my mind!