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My nana, who is dying of endstage emphysema, and getting worse every day told the hospice chaplain that she wants to die with me and my two boys at her side....um, i love her with all of my heart and would do anything for her, and if i have to, I would be at her side, but I pray to God that when he decides to bring her home to please let him do it in her sleep....idk that i will be able to not totally lose it if im there when it happens, i know i dont want my 10 year old to endure that, and my 18 year old says no way, he can barely handle to come visit her periiodically b/c the ill lady in the other room is not his nana....so do I discuss this with her? Do i discuss it with hospice chaplain and ask him to talk to her about it, or do I just leave it it God's hands, since that's where it all is anyway. And am I selfish for even thinking any of this?

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pooh, my heart goes out to you in your situation. There are so many choices. I'm sure your nana's main concern is that she doesn't want to die alone. I can understand her wanting you there but not your kids. You don't want them to experience it so they shouldn't plan to be there, they're your kids and you know what's best for them. Maybe you and the chaplain can find some way of reassuring nana that someone will be with her if possible. When my dad passed away at home, my 20yr old daughter and I were on our way out to get groceries when a huge thunderstorm blew in so we stayed waiting for it to get over. Dad died peacefully with us by his bedside giving him words of encouragement. To this day, we both are thankful for that storm or we'd have missed saying goodbye. On the other hand, my grandma died all alone in the hospital a few hrs after my daughter and I'd been to visit. It makes me sad to think she was by herself. To be there or not be there is such a personal decision. If you choose not to be there don't feel guilty about it. Nana could pass in the middle of the night in her sleep and it's doubltful you'd be there anyway. I truly believe she's afraid and just wants to know she won't be by herself. Sometimes a dying wish is impossible to keep.
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I think its a crying shame that people run from the bad times but are there for the good times,if you can't trust family to uphold your wishes who can you trust.I told my daughter[whom was almost five when she saw her dad take his last breath]if you have one or two people in your whole you can trust,count yourself lucky.I for one am glad I have been one of those people someone can count on.
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I left out the word LIFE,IF YOU HAVE ONE OR TWO PEOPLE IN YOUR WHOLE LIFE YOU CAN COUNT ON ,YOU ARE LUCKY-LIFE IS NOT ALWAYS ABOUT THE GOOD AND THE WONDERFUL-KIDS SHOULD KNOW THIS-THEY WILL BE OLD ONE DAY THEM-SELVES,DO THEY WANT TO BE ABANDONED AT THE END. 18 YEAR OLD BOYS GO TO WAR EVERYDAY TO KILL AND GET KILLED; WHO SHELTERS THEM.A TEN YEAR OLD GIRL I UNDERSTAND, BUT A 18 YEAR OLD- YOUNG MAN NEEDS TO BE TAUGHT NOT TO RUN FROM THE ONES YOU LOVE-SHE IS STILL HIS GRANDMA AND SHE IS THE ONE THAT IS SICK.One day he may be sick and he may not be so cool,will he want to feel abondoned at the end.
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Pooh what a great topic, and this is a great question.

My 21 yr old is like your son. He is sensitive and get's quite upset when he goes to see my mom, (his grandma). He always tries to be hard, but once he sets foot into her room and starts talking to mom he has to go out for a time, and he actually cries.

My 19 yr old on the other hand is quite good with my mom. He spends time, right next to her and reads to her, and makes her laugh. Whatever she needs he's there for her. He has always been able to make us all laugh.

I wouln't push my sons into anything they didn't want to do. If they chose not to be there I would accept it. I've already spoken about this with them and one never knows when that time comes what will happen. I may break down and they may need to be there for me, I just don't know. But as far as holding them to being there to watch someone die, I wouldn't commit them to that. They've gone through something similar with my X's mother and it took them a long time to get over it. Every child is different and mourns in different ways.

Sure they will get old, I pray they live a long healthy life. I pray they have a great relationship with God, a great family, and great health. But I would let them say what they wanted, and they themselves would have to live with it.

I pray that my moms transition is peaceful and that she not be afraid to let go. I also pray that same prayer for myself when my time comes.

I hope this helps.
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Hi,this is tennessee's daughter.I am 10 years old.I helped my mom when my grandfather was sick and I was only six. I was in the ICU with him when I was six or seven.We basically lived with him for a while. We visited him as often as we could when he was in the hospital and nearly every day when he wasn't.I was with him because I loved him.My dad had cancer nearly all my life and I didn't go to a different room.I was four and younger. I went to the hospital with him and I didn't mind.I just wished for him to get better.I was in the same room he was in when he died I was asleep but I was in the same room.I woke up right after he died though. I thought he was asleep.
I think there are some wimps and selfish people on this sight and yes, I think you are selfish for thinking this pooh4292. You should forfill your mothers wish.And yes my mom gave me permission to write.
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hmmmmmmmmmmm isn't today a school day?
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Death is just a natural part of life and I think we do children (and ourselves) a big diservice by making this natural passing a fearful event. Sure, it is not a pretty sight watching someone we love leave us. On the other hand, leaving them alone to die when we could have been present is apalling to me.
I am afraid that we are not allowing children and young people to step up and take responsibility on many levels. I hate to think what their future is going to look like.
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I just don't think an elder should make the decision for a child to witness their death. It should be left up to the child. If that child has had a healthy and wonderful relationship with that elder, they will make the right choice, but it should be their choice and they should come to it by themselves.
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tennessee's daughter - No, pam for me it is summer vacation and I am a straight A student the lowest grade I got on my report card final EVER was a A-.And I chose to be with my grandfather and dad because I LOVE them.And just to let you know I read these comments because I was a caregiver for MUCH longer than 4 months.
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tennessee's daughter- Thank you Lilliput for having common sense and not being selfish.Yes, it is appalling for leaving loved ones to die alone and death IS a natural part of life even though it is very sad.I also hate to think what the future is going to look like.
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Seems like both tennessee and tennessee's daughter are very angry. Life must have really dealt you a raw deal.

But it's good to know that you're both on this forum helping and encouraging people, that is what this site is all about.

Both of you keep up the good work, and remain blessed, highly favored, and in the midst of miracles.
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Pamela, that was beautifully stated. There's a difference in coddling and giving a child the freedom to make their own decisions.
I'd like to ask if nana only told the chaplain about her wishes or has she stated this to you also, pooh?
I can only use my mom as a gauge, but one of her wishes is to have a certain preacher conduct her service when she passes. She insists on it. Well, goodness alive, this man has to be 95, if he's even still alive. She's letting her wants overrule reality. Sometimes a dying wish is impossible to fulfill.
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U R so right AlwaysMyDuty.....so right:)
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O.k. I RAN THE KID AWAY FROM THE COMPUTER... but you must understand she has been through more than most of you all,she did not chose for her dad to die,he just did,yes we all were very close,and yes her opinion matters greatly.We are not in the age of kids being seen and not heard,she reads this site as I do,she also notices alot of adults think more of themselves than others. I however do agree with PAM,about not making a kid do something they do not want to do,not all kids love grandma and grandpa or mom and dad the same.Some folks I don't want to be around alive much least dead or dying.When someone is grieving-freaking out[you grieve before someone dies you know]you don't always make the right choice,but you still have to live with it.Thats where my concern is.DEATH AND DYING SUCKS PERIOD,but to live with no regrets makes it bareable.Yes, I did give her permission to use the computer to write her feelings.Thanks LILLIPUT for your opinion,I AGREE 100 PERCENT,BUT IT WAS MY DAUGHTER WHO GAVE YOU THE STAR.
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I would leave it up to your children and if you feel you yourself can not be there at the end you should not be when my husband passed away my adult children and teenage grand-daughter were there with me but we knew the end was near he had been taken off his life-support meds because he had no chance of recovery at all. That does not mean she will be alone-in this day and age with DNR's required for just about anyone esp. the elders a nurse will usually stay with a patient when the end is close-nurses usually know-I was a nurse and stayed with many dieing pt.s when the end was near if they were a DNR.
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Austin you are a very special person for what you have gone through and what you do for folks,but people dying would rather be with the ones they love the most----if given the choice.
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Hey Maxine nice to hear from you. That's good to know that a nurse will usually remain with a patient in their time of need.
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tennessee my sister is not doing all the caregiving. There is a 3-way split between the helper, my sister and myself.
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"She told the hospice chaplain that she wants to die with me and my two boys at her side....um, "

1. When the hospice chaplian shared this with you did they also include how they responded? My own take on this woud have been to validate her feelings while encouraging her to express and discuss this wish with you.

2. The one thing that I have not read in any response is the issue of timing probability. I've seen enough people die which included times when the family was called during which experiences the exact or even close to it time of death was varried.

What I am trying to say is that while the fear of abandonment and the desire to die without feeling alone is entirely understandable, the likelyhood of any one particular family member being right there by her side at her precise point of death has a very, very low probability. The only way to increase the probability is to stay right there 24/7 which is neither healthy nor realistic.

3. What advice or instruction did the hospice chaplain offer?

Having almost died myself many years ago, I will say that from my own experience the medical information is very true that the very last sense to go is hearing.

This is not an easy situation at all and one which needs all of us to be supportive first and foremost.
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Amen Crowe Amen!
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This probably will either sound depressed or like True Grit.

Concerning being alone.

1. In a sense, we are alone in the womb when we go through the birth cannal until we are actually born.

2. There are critical decisions that each person can only make for themselves if they are to grow in that developmental stage of life. In those times, we often feel alone.

3. When it comes to the actual act or experience of dying our hearing, if we had any to begin with, is gone and in a sense we die alone which lasts until we are on the other side where we are no longer alone.

Best of all, God is with us.
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Even greater Crowe God is with us in Life and Death. Now ain't that a gas!
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Yes and that last line actualy is a quote from John Wesley's dying moments.

To get techical, God was there at the very moment of our conception as our parents were co-creators with God of us as a living being.

Amen, God is with us in life, death, and after death!
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Crowe, I said in my first post that nana might die in her sleep one night and none of the family might not be there with her. I was trying to say that unless nana is unplugged, only God knows exactly when she's going to pass away. I say this because of the timing involving my dad's death. We thought dad had a few months left. It was only by God's dealing that my daughter and I were with dad the evening he died. Otherwise, I would have had to plan to be with dad 24/7, just like you said.
Even though my dad was dying, I want so badly to believe he heard my words. Thanks Crowe for saying that the hearing is the last to go.
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When it was apparent that I was not going to die but who knew how long remain in a semi-consious state, I did remember each person who came into the room and what they said. My mind did not let me completely remember everything about the almost death inflicting accident until I got off of the dilanten a year later. Then, it all rushed in my head like a bolt of lightiing and I found myself going to each person telling them what I had heard them talk about. That experience made me very aware of the need to be careful and wise what we say around people we don't think actually hear us.

I've visited people in hospital rooms that no one thought was awake or would wake up to whom I read from the Bible and they remebered it when they came totally too later.

From all of that, I would say it is very likely that your dad did hear you.
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Thanks, Crowe, it really means a lot to read your words. I don't know why after all these long years it means so much to me to think dad heard me, but it does. This topic has made me miss my dad today. I am a lot like my dad, very private, never wanting a fuss made. If dad could've picked how he wanted things to go down, he would've voted for going to the woods alone and waiting for it to be over, like an aged animal. I pretty much second that when it comes to my time. He always told me it wasn't the dying that was important or the funeral or who came to see you. It was your relationship with God and knowing you were going to heaven. Sorry, I didn't mean to get preachy. I just think dad was right.
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first and foremost, i did state that if it had to be, I would be there by her side, holding her hand, doing whatever she wanted when she goes home, I just wish she would pass in her sleep, neither alone nor wirh us, just go to sleep and wake up with God. I would never deprive her of her wish, if that is God's will too, I was just stating my uneasiness with this. i lost my mom @ 7 y.o. in which nana took over, adopted me, raised me and gave up her life for me, I had no problem doing the same, i have been anything but selfish...and my 18 year old knows what he can handle, he came over tonight when she was having a very hard time, and it killed him to see her like that, that's not his nana and it's painful for him. I know adults who make choices to go see sick ones b/c of the pain it causes, it seems more understandable froma kid's pointn of view, esp one who has had a rough past himself...and as far as the 10 year old, i will give him a choice, but i dont want him to be traumatized by witnessing his nana die....that's gotta be painful and will break my heart...well whats not already broken....i can only imagine what it would do to a child that may not even grasp the reality of death, this will be his first. I appreciate the advice and the things that y'all shared in your experiences...I did talk to the chaplain today, and we prayed for what is God's will, for that is wht it all comes down to. She's declining rapidly and i've been there every minute she's needed me i wont abandon her in her last minutes, ijust wanted insight into how others felt and some opinions...didnt expect to be called selfish or have my son torn in to b/c of who he is and what he can handle :( sorry if im steppinng on toes...
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pooh4292, the replies which have been shared with you thus far reflect tremendous compassion, wisdom and caring. The question and issue you pose is a sensitive and complex issue. I wholeheartedly understand and support your candid sharing that even though you love your nana, you would rather not be at her side when she takes her last breaths. There is nothing wrong with your wish. It is true that your nana does not wish to die alone. I am sure there are many people who feel the same way. Letting go is never easy. Don't allow yourself to crumble under the pressure of how you may be perceived because of what you feel and have shared here. If you are not present with your nana when she dies, your love for her will not be any less. In death, as in life, our individual comfort level should always remain visible. Your nana's expectation is hers, not yours. Let the chaplain know how you feel. I can't imagine a hospice professional who will not understand where you are emotionally on this issue. A good hospice professional will help you to sort through your feelings - if you wish to do so, but if you don't wish to sort through the issues at this time, there is nothing wrong with that, either. You may be on emotional overload and at your limit for the time being. I respect that, and understand. You need to move at your own pace. For me, fast-forwarding one's emotions to adjust to someone else's expectation of what you should be doing is not helpful or emotionally healthy.

Whatever your final decision may be, make it right for you. Love transcends rituals. Best to you, your children and your nana during this difficult period in your lives. Am saying a little prayer for right outcomes and guidance for you. Keep sharing if it helps any, ok?
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Please all remember how sad we all are in our own lives while we deal with the transistions of those we love so much. All I do is cry.
No one is selfish, no one is angry and no one hurts like we all hurt in our own ways.
There is a world of difference between anger and grief. And our grief will surface in unusual ways.
blessings to all who take the time to answer and help those of us who need the help and support to make it through another day.

Pooh: you are right. God will decide and at the end of the day it all really doesn't matter. You and your children love your nana and she knows that and so does God. he will spare you and yours what you truly cannot handle and it's no concern to anyone but you and your children.
Your nana will be released from her pain and she will know the truth and the huge scope of your love and she will smile with the countenance of a saint when she takes her place in the heavens.

As for the thoughts of our 10 year old 'old soul', I am interested in what you have to say. You are a caring individual to take your time to help us and what you did wth your Dad and Grandad is so sweet and enough to bring me to tears. Just please be tender with us because we are bruised and broken with life and the pain we feel now is something you have already experienced and have the wisdom to help guide us and I for one thank you. Just be tender with Pooh and her children and Pamela and her amazing challenges while she cares for her mom. We are all tired and sore and ready to be on the BOAT!

Wish I had something more intelligent to say but I am in fear that my mom won't last the night and I can't stop crying. I want her to be released from her suffering but the selfish part of me dosen't want her to go. Ow. Hurts so bad. I hope I'm next to her when it happens.
I sat ther so long yesterday that my butt fell asleep. I didn't realize it was asleep until I tried to walk across the room. I'm walking like one of Jerry's kids and mom sees me and gives me the eyebrows as in what's up and I said A** asleep and she laughed. I could live with a sleepy butt forever if I could hear my mother's laugh.

Love to all and please let's love each other. In some cases we are all each of us has. (Like my case).

lovbob
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Bob, you have said it all and said it so eloquently. I am very sorry that your Mom may be on her deathbed this evening. May you both find comfort in being with each other tonight and as long as God grants your Mom breath. Yes, it is hard, and like you, my love of my Mom as my life-long best friend doesn't want to lose her. Intellectually, just like you, neither do I want my beloved mother to suffer. In the end, when that time comes, is all in God's hands, not ours. If it is any consolation, I learned when my beloved Dad died many years ago that love never, ever dies. Your love for your Mom shines bright. Cry the night away if you need to. Those are healing tears coming from your heart which is filled with love. Will say a little prayer for you and Mom before I turn in to bed tonight. Peace, and much love.
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