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Could you explain a bit more? If he is brain dead, why is he being maintained? and why is being transferred? I'm not sure if Medicare will cover care for someone who has been pronounced brain dead.
If someone is brain dead they are either being maintained artificially or body functions will soon stop as the respiratory/cardiac center fades. If not maintained on artificial support, this usually happens in 1-2 days. There is no way to reverse brain death. I don't think that we would even want to try. If the hospital is talking about transfer, I have a feeling that the patient is on a ventilator. This makes me wonder if a medical POA is in place to make decisions for the person.
The question really doesn't make sense, since rehab wouldn't be useful at all for someone who is brain dead. We need more info.
Oh wow, I'm so sorry to hear that! I would definitely get Hospice involved if he is moved to a Nursing facility, but Hospice Does Not cover the Nursing home, however if he has not used up his yearly allowance of 100 days paid, or whatever it is, Medicare should pick that up, and I doubt your Dad will live that long, understanding his condition, I'm so sorry!
At least with Hospice, he will get additional care, above and beyond the usual Nursing care, but still, they are only there about 2-4 hours per week, but available by phone 24/7.
I'm still not understanding why they are sending him outside of the hospital, as it sounds like his time is limited, perhaps he can be transfered to a Hospice Hospital, where his entire stay Would be covered by Medicare. They normally allow this to happen, when someone's life expectancy is to be less than 7-10 days.
I would definitely speak with the Hospitals Social Worker, to help you in your decision making. Take care.
Staceyb, if he is brain dead, then how does hospice work? I mean, he is already dead, right? I think family should check out the financial side of all this very carefully so they don't have any nasty surprises ahead. And, if someone is brain dead, why cannot they be left in peace?
Hello ! Sorry to hear... when a POA has to make decisions about nursing home care is scarey and confusing...this is what I have learned from my own experience as a caregiver ....medicare will pay for 100 days in nursing home ;.....If your loved one has not been in a nursing home for 100 days.Now let's say your Dad was in the nursing home for 70 days ;he should still have 30 paid days by medicare in the nursing home .The social worker should know how it works .Now if this time is all used up ,you may consider hospice ,and bring dad home. Or check an ,assisted living ,and put him on hospice .But, dad will have to pay for assisted liveing,...Hospice will be paid by medicare. Maybe the criteria to get hospice would be failure to thrive.Sadly there is not many choices .GOOD LUCK
Romana, clearly the Father is still very much alive, although has very limited brain function, just enough to continue breathing and heart beating, these actions come from the brain stem, and to my knowledge, that process only holds out so long before it too gives up working.
Hospice would be brought in to provide the patient And the family, comfort care, bi-weekly evaluations, medications, bed baths, and clergy, should the family and the patient desire it. Still, the patient might be moved to a Nursing home, and Hospice care would be added as an additional layer after assistance. Who pays for what will be determined by the Social worker, Medicare, Medicaid, and the patients insurance coverage.
These services could be performed at home with a very involved, very dedicated family unit, but it would be extremely difficult, or in a Nursing or Rehab facility, or in the Hospice Hospital, which would be my first choice if at all possible, as IMO, they give such wonderful care at the end of life.
Perhaps the OP eould like to give more details as to how advanced their Dad's health issues are impacting their difficult decisions. Either way, the whole situation is a very Sad one, and my prayers are with this family who is dealing with this.
You need more information. As POA I would stubbornly state that your father cannot be moved unless he has been weaned off the respirator and can breathe in his own.
This is a slippery slope because 1) I have read if there is no improvement in rehab, insurance won't pay. 2) so many reasons to delay the transfer.
Start getting second opinions while they attempt weaning. Just grasping at straws.
James, did he have a stroke? As others have asked, why is he being transferred for rehab unless his treating physician(s) feel that the brain situation can be reversed?
I would check this out before he's discharged or transferred anywhere. If you can't meet with the attending physician, tell one of the staff, or the discharge planner, that you definitely need to speak with the attending to discuss the post discharge plan of care.
If he does go to a facility, you'll want to be very clear what the goals are so you don't get stuck paying if there's no real plan for recovery.
And if you sign for his admission, sign only as proxy pursuant to a POA. Don't sign individually or you could be held liable for payment, especially if Medicare won't pay, which I suspect b/c of the brain diagnosis. And give the facility a copy of the POA; don't give them the original.
Good luck. I hope you have family and friends to support you during this challenging time.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
A.
I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
B.
APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
C.
APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
D.
If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records.
E.
This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year.
F.
You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
The question really doesn't make sense, since rehab wouldn't be useful at all for someone who is brain dead. We need more info.
At least with Hospice, he will get additional care, above and beyond the usual Nursing care, but still, they are only there about 2-4 hours per week, but available by phone 24/7.
I'm still not understanding why they are sending him outside of the hospital, as it sounds like his time is limited, perhaps he can be transfered to a Hospice Hospital, where his entire stay Would be covered by Medicare. They normally allow this to happen, when someone's life expectancy is to be less than 7-10 days.
I would definitely speak with the Hospitals Social Worker, to help you in your decision making. Take care.
Hospice would be brought in to provide the patient And the family, comfort care, bi-weekly evaluations, medications, bed baths, and clergy, should the family and the patient desire it. Still, the patient might be moved to a Nursing home, and Hospice care would be added as an additional layer after assistance. Who pays for what will be determined by the Social worker, Medicare, Medicaid, and the patients insurance coverage.
These services could be performed at home with a very involved, very dedicated family unit, but it would be extremely difficult, or in a Nursing or Rehab facility, or in the Hospice Hospital, which would be my first choice if at all possible, as IMO, they give such wonderful care at the end of life.
Perhaps the OP eould like to give more details as to how advanced their Dad's health issues are impacting their difficult decisions. Either way, the whole situation is a very Sad one, and my prayers are with this family who is dealing with this.
As POA I would stubbornly state that your father cannot be moved unless he has been weaned off the respirator and can breathe in his own.
This is a slippery slope because 1) I have read if there is no improvement in rehab, insurance won't pay. 2) so many reasons to delay the transfer.
Start getting second opinions while they attempt weaning. Just grasping at straws.
I hope you can consult a lawyer for your father.
Sorry to hear about your father's condition.
I would check this out before he's discharged or transferred anywhere. If you can't meet with the attending physician, tell one of the staff, or the discharge planner, that you definitely need to speak with the attending to discuss the post discharge plan of care.
If he does go to a facility, you'll want to be very clear what the goals are so you don't get stuck paying if there's no real plan for recovery.
And if you sign for his admission, sign only as proxy pursuant to a POA. Don't sign individually or you could be held liable for payment, especially if Medicare won't pay, which I suspect b/c of the brain diagnosis. And give the facility a copy of the POA; don't give them the original.
Good luck. I hope you have family and friends to support you during this challenging time.