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Hi Craig What you are suggesting is a form of fraud. What state does your mom live in? Are you saying she intends to stay in her cabin and have someone come in to assist her with her activities of daily living etc? Depending on her state there might be Medicaid provisions for this. Your best course of action would be to visit a certified elder attorney in her state to discuss her options BEFORE filing for Medicaid. She must qualify financially and medically. There are some states who make provisions for elders to retain possession of their homes and be able to pass them to their heirs under specific circumstances. See an attorney.
Is the cabin her principal home and/or has a homestead exemption? If so, it’s a exempt asset for Medicaid for most states so she does not need to sell it to qualify for Medicaid. But due to Medicaids copay requirements, she will have no $ to pay property costs. So family will need to pay all in order fir her to own it. And pay from day 1 till beyond death through whatever MERP estate recovery &/or probate process is done.
But if it’s a second or vacation home, it’s a NON-EXEMPT asset of hers. Not allowed by Medicaid. Only until it’s sold at FMV with all proceeds of the sale used for her Medicaid spend down will she be Medicaid eligible.
Her QCD of cabin to you whether it’s 100% / $160k or 50% / 80k or 50k will be considered gifting of an asset by Medicaid and will place a period of ineligiblity for Medicaid for her. Remember in order to file for LTC Medicaid, she needs to be living in the NH or AL. So facility must be paid each month. Medicaid will find the transfer and when it surfaces, will let you, mom and the NH/AL know. In order for mom to stay, she will have to private pay and from day 1 of admission. If not paid, she will get a 30 Day Notice to move. Facility will attempt whatever to get paid. If that means contacting APS to have mom become ward of the state or ask APS to look at your taking advantage of a vulnerable adult by buying a 160k property for 50k...... they can do both. APS investigation on you will not be pretty. As 97yroldmom said..... it’s a form of fraud.
ALSO If mom does not own the cabin outright, like if there’s a mortgage or other secured lending on it, she cannot “sell it”. She can only place her equity interest in the property via a QCD. A QCD does not convey guaranteed ownership, that is only through a Warranty Deed. The mortgage holder or other secured lender will need to agree to & allow any changes in ownership. That usually means the mortgage is “struck” & fully paid off with a new mortgage done for you IF you can meet their lending requirements. If there’s a mortgage and you all do a QCD without notifying the lender, they can call in the loan, which means payment of mortgage balance in full within 30-60 days or they consider it to now be bank owned.
CraigB, your mother should probably not quitclaim her cabin to you for anything less than its fair market value unless you or she is prepared to pay her assisted-living costs for the value of any gift given after she applies for Medicaid. I believe most states have a look-back period (e.g. 5 years) during which any gifts made by applicants will result in a penalty period equal to the value of such gifts. So, sale of a $160,000 cabin for $50,000 will result in a penalty of $110,000 and if the cost of care is $5,000 per month the penalty period will be 22 months that Medicaid will not pay for such care. Exclusion of a home as an asset is actually a deferral, i.e. Medicaid won't require that it be immediately sold, but it will probably place a lien on the home for future recovery of Medicaid expenditures. These are some of the generalities, but there are exceptions and every state has different rules. I second the earlier advice of consulting with an elder-law attorney in your state who is experienced in Medicaid rules before your mother applies for Medicaid.
no, Medicaid needs to go back 5 years. the process is involved and they look at every penny she gives away. I'm still trying to sell a house worth about the same amount. Lots of lawyer fees and this is still going on for over a year.
Medicaid will ask that a house be sold at Market Value. Even after Moms house Didn't sell, they wouldn't allow me to lower the price. Mom has passed all Medicaid cares about now is the 6k owed. I can now sell for whatever I can get as long as the lean is satisfied.
Medicaid gets sticky when it comes to homes they allow you to keep. I just wonder how many homes become abandoned because of Medicaid. All income, SS and pensions, go to residents care. So unless someone is living in the house paying bills or family member willing to take on the costs, the house just sits and rots.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
A.
I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
B.
APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
C.
APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
D.
If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records.
E.
This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year.
F.
You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
What you are suggesting is a form of fraud.
What state does your mom live in? Are you saying she intends to stay in her cabin and have someone come in to assist her with her activities of daily living etc?
Depending on her state there might be Medicaid provisions for this.
Your best course of action would be to visit a certified elder attorney in her state to discuss her options BEFORE filing for Medicaid.
She must qualify financially and medically.
There are some states who make provisions for elders to retain possession of their homes and be able to pass them to their heirs under specific circumstances. See an attorney.
If so, it’s a exempt asset for Medicaid for most states so she does not need to sell it to qualify for Medicaid. But due to Medicaids copay requirements, she will have no $ to pay property costs. So family will need to pay all in order fir her to own it. And pay from day 1 till beyond death through whatever MERP estate recovery &/or probate process is done.
But if it’s a second or vacation home, it’s a NON-EXEMPT asset of hers. Not allowed by Medicaid. Only until it’s sold at FMV with all proceeds of the sale used for her Medicaid spend down will she be Medicaid eligible.
Her QCD of cabin to you whether it’s 100% / $160k or 50% / 80k or 50k will be considered gifting of an asset by Medicaid and will place a period of ineligiblity for Medicaid for her. Remember in order to file for LTC Medicaid, she needs to be living in the NH or AL. So facility must be paid each month. Medicaid will find the transfer and when it surfaces, will let you, mom and the NH/AL know. In order for mom to stay, she will have to private pay and from day 1 of admission. If not paid, she will get a 30 Day Notice to move. Facility will attempt whatever to get paid. If that means contacting APS to have mom become ward of the state or ask APS to look at your taking advantage of a vulnerable adult by buying a 160k property for 50k...... they can do both. APS investigation on you will not be pretty. As 97yroldmom said..... it’s a form of fraud.
ALSO If mom does not own the cabin outright, like if there’s a mortgage or other secured lending on it, she cannot “sell it”. She can only place her equity interest in the property via a QCD. A QCD does not convey guaranteed ownership, that is only through a Warranty Deed. The mortgage holder or other secured lender will need to agree to & allow any changes in ownership. That usually means the mortgage is “struck” & fully paid off with a new mortgage done for you IF you can meet their lending requirements. If there’s a mortgage and you all do a QCD without notifying the lender, they can call in the loan, which means payment of mortgage balance in full within 30-60 days or they consider it to now be bank owned.
Medicaid gets sticky when it comes to homes they allow you to keep. I just wonder how many homes become abandoned because of Medicaid. All income, SS and pensions, go to residents care. So unless someone is living in the house paying bills or family member willing to take on the costs, the house just sits and rots.