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My mom is 71, lives at home with my dad and is very able to get around on her own. My dad wouldn't dare say anything back to her because he will pay for it in guilt and her dragged on frustration rants. I'm the only girl and the youngest of 3 with a full time job, 3 teenagers in sports and very rarely time to just be by myself or with my husband. My mom includes herself in every single thing I do, if not, I'm ignoring and avoiding her. She has to have my location on her phone and see my calendar so she can be at every single event I go to. This resulted in her making her gyno appt the same day, time and place as mine! I had to travel for work and my location stopped at the last airport and she was freaking out, texting and calling my cell phone which didn't have signal until we landed again. She immediately goes to crazy thoughts. She came to my high school reunion and inserted herself in my friend conversations. At any sport events (multiple times a week) if she’s not sitting between me and someone I'm trying to talk to, it means I'm ignoring her. I do love my mom very much but if I'm not giving her every detail of my day to day she says I'm ignoring and avoiding her, then cries to my dad for days. She gives me snide comments with huge guilt trips. If I make a post on social media she over analyses and has to know why and what's going on. Sad if I bought something for myself with out her knowing or including her first. Gets upset if I don't want to talk about every detail (including intimate) about me and my husband. She comes on all of my family vacations and it's just exhausting tending to her feelings instead of my family.


My husband gets more days off from work than I do, he and his dad went on a day trip fishing. I got the biggest guilt trip that I don't take take off from work and take her out on a day of shopping.


I do have a brother that's also in town, he does some with her but not much. I have asked him to do more, help me find her a friend or a hobby. Something. I have a horrible feeling of claustrophobia and have put on a fake act when she’s around so I don't hurt her feelings.


I've tried tough love and it got worse - she cried for weeks. Do I need to talk to a doctor about this? She is not diagnosed with anything to my knowledge. Am I being heartless for not wanting to tend to her feelings more?

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Heartless? Goodness. This sounds completely untenable to me. I don't know how you've put up with this for this long. I'm not sure what the solution is, and I'm sure the very smart folks here will have some good advice, but you're definitely not being heartless.
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Well, it appears that she is driving the car and you are riding in the back seat.

What are your boundaries? Do you stand firm with them?

She is controlling your life, your well-being. IMO, you are too concerned about her feelings and not concerned enough about you, your rights, your life.

Guilt is a self-imposed emotion, fueled by fear, what are you afraid of? Losing her love?

You do understand that she is manipulating you, big time.

I would sit her down and be honest, if she cries let her, she will get over it. Set your boundaries and stick to them. You have taught her how to treat you, you are putty in her hands.

You are not responsible for her happiness; you are responsible for yours.

Stop telling her everything, it is not her business, you are an adult, that means you are her equal, demand your position in life.

If you cannot take back your life on your own, I might suggest therapy to help you regain you.

I understand this will not be easy, however, you are entitled to a life! My best!
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This is unhinged behavior coming from your mother, 100%. You are not heartless at all. It is totally abnormal for a mother to insert herself into her daughter's life to this extent, and to then assault you with FOG (fear obligation & guilt) if you don't bow down to her demands! It's outrageous, in fact, and I'm surprised you've put up with it for so long! She's held you and your father emotionally hostage for all these years, and you're both afraid of standing up to her for fear of 'hurting her feelings' because somehow, you've decided HER feelings take precedence over YOURS. That her life is more important than yours, so you've taken a backseat in your own life~

Here's a good article on Passive-Aggressive behaviors:

https://www.excelatlife.com/articles/crazy-makers.htm

And here is another good article discussing the 25 signs of Covert Passive/Aggressive Narcissists:

https://lifelessons.co/personal-development/covertpassiveaggressivenarcissist/

Another good book is Boundaries by Cloud & Townsend which you can purchase on Amazon or eBay.

It's not okay for mom to USURP your life. Seek the counsel of a good therapist who can walk you through how to set down boundaries with her, and how to back away from mom to some degree in an effort to save yourself and your immediate family. How to put yourself first for a change.

**I see you put down Alzheimers/dementia that mom suffers from. OCD behaviors are part of Alz/dementia so I assume this obsession with you has worsened over the years? She needs a visit with her doc/neurologist along with YOU to discuss medication to relieve some of this OCD/anxiety she is suffering from.

Wishing you the best of luck with a difficult situation.
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TChamp May 2022
This is not OCD. Her mother is an over-possessive and intrusive person. That has been her personality all along with or without dementia. There is no cure for it. Daughter has to find her own exit.
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Has she always been like this, or has her obsession with you developed and grown only in the last few years?
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How much more can you tend to her?
71, married, they need their own life, you need yours.
Maybe therapy for her how to detach? You know it will get worse as she ages?
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Beatty May 2022
Yes. I imagine therapy for support while instilling new boundaries could be very very useful.

I delt with a MUCH milder case & therapy really did help.
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You're an adult. You're the master of your environment, no one else is. Divorce your mother. No one is going to blame you.
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You have allowed her to be in control of your every move, which I find quite ridiculous, especially since she has a husband and is in good health.
I think perhaps it's you that needs to speak to a doctor, preferably a therapist or psychologist to find out why at your age you still allow your mom to rule your life.
It's time to say enough is enough and let the chips fall where they may.
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Make it so she can no longer see your location and calendar.
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I would consider some therapy. You and your Mom have formed an unhealthy symbiotic relationship that it is unlikely for a simple Forum to have answers for. You both play a part in this and it becomes an equal sort of co-relationship.
It will be difficult for you to change because this is the "known" for you now, and you--though you may be uncomfortable with it--are "used" to this way of interacting. Any change will represent an unknown that can at first be terrifying. You will need support.
At 71 your Mom should be directed to her own therapy if she is having trouble crying "for weeks".
Love never has to be tough, but it doesn't have to be a prison either. This sort of very unhealthy actions and reaction can be treated kindly. But playing into this hand is harmful for both you and for Mom herself.
You are in charge of your life, from how often you answer your phone to what activities are appropriate to share with your Mother. You are NOT in charge of Mom's life, actions, or reactions. She is responsible for that.
Do seek help. You will be glad that you did. Not about your MOM, but about YOU. I wish you the best. Change will at first be difficult, but when you see how much happier you are, you will be so grateful you took the courage to do it.
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Grow a backbone and tell mom you're an adult and will not be playing her game anymore.
The only way mom is going to be able to know all of your business and run all of your business is if you go along with it and allow her to.
Your father doesn't cross her because he has to live with her.
You don't. Stop letting her nosiness run your life. Put your foot down.
The End.
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Block her? Why is she able to see your calendar or where you are all the time.

The alternative is start going to places she'd not want to go to. Go to a strip club and welcome her with a big smile.
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LoopyLoo May 2022
Haha!! That’s an awesome idea!
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You are enabling her. You are allowing her to do this to you. That being said (not guilting you, just stating facts): you need to put up boundaries to protect you and your family (husband and kids) from her mental illness. Your father must fend for himself (and he is not help, obviously).

You are not responsible for your mother's happiness. You cannot "cure" her, she doesn't even see this as 100% dysfunctional behavior. You have a co-dependent relationship with her that is 100% abnormal. You and your father are parties to this, and you are the only ones that can stop the impact of her actions on you by putting up clear and strong barriers. If you do this, expect blow-back from her but do not back down. She is going to do everything to run over and disrespect you and your boundaries and if you let her, nothing will change and it will be your choice that nothing changes. It is not going to change on its own.

I think you would really benefit from seeing a therapist to help you identify boundaries and strategies to keep the up and strong. Your mother is a sick woman and when you allow her outrageous intrustions, you give her the impression that what she's doing is acceptable. It isn't. I wish you all the best.
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I wore a new shirt once around my mother. She asked where/when I got it. I told her and her reply was "didn't you think about calling me to see if I wanted to go to ______ and shop". One ticket to the passive aggressive express guilt trip please. My mom still drives and the store I went to is five minutes from her apartment. You can never win in these situations. If I wear clothes that she's used to I get "you seem to always wear the same clothes". Damned if you do damned if you do. Since she has access to your calendar don't put everything on your calendar and taper off how much you share with her. If she cries and cries just let her. She will get over it, trust me on this one. By her some water when she cries so she doesn't dehydrate.
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BurntCaregiver May 2022
You state it perfectly, Jhalldenton. My mother is exactly the same way. It was at a point where I couldn't leave the house without providing every detail of where I was going and exactly how long I would be gone. Usually there was a list of demands along with it. These days I do not explain myself when I'm going out. I will ask her to write down a list of things she needs if I'm running errands.
I shut that nonsense behavior down quick. I have a right to go out for a meal with my ex-husband and our boy without having to keep an entree hot in the car to bring home for her. She makes snide comments about my ex-husband in front of him, but not directly to him. Usually we ignore her, but sometimes she has to be told to shut up and no one cares what she thinks. I told her that at some point I'm moving back with him and she will not be coming. So she's doubling down on the snideness, negativity, and passive/aggressive attacks on us both. I ignore her. My ex-husband does too. He never really saw that much of her anyway and she wasn't at our wedding and most likely won't be at out next one.
I've been doing the give her a bottle of water to not dehydrate from crying for a long time.
People have to protect their own mental health from these emotional vampires who use passive/aggressive guilt-tripping, negativity, and indirect snideness to suck the life out of the people who actually help them. You protect yourself by either cutting these people out of your life completely or by learning to ignore them when you need to.
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I find this absolutely bizarre. From the sound of it, it’s been going on for years. How did you let it start? If mother’s only 71, did you ever have a life of your own? Did you go away to college, have a job somewhere else, even go on holiday with a friend? Did she contact you every day of your honeymoon?

The fact that you can consider asking “Am I being heartless for not wanting to tend to her feelings more?” suggests that you just don’t get how bizarre this is.

Does anyone in your family ever put their foot down? Your father doesn’t. Does your husband just leave it up to you – even though it’s so bad for you? I can imagine brothers feeling glad that it takes the pressure off them – but how do your sisters-in-law get on? Are your three kids always polite?

You know exactly how mother likes things to be, so asking her to change is not a viable strategy. It’s about you. A list might include:
1) Therapy for you, to include DH when appropriate.
2) An additional phone for you, with a new number for things that are just your business.
3) A holiday away.
4) Coming off Facebook – groups only, and they don’t admit mother.
5) Enthusiasm if husband wants to take a job elsewhere.
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I am so sorry! Please, please, please seek out a therapist--for yourself. If you try one and it's not a good fit--if you don't feel comfortable--try another. The pandemic has brought telehealth for psychotherapy into its own, and there are many good companies that offer services this way. Often because they employ so many therapists they do not have the huge waiting lists local therapist have. (Where I live every therapist and every agency has a long waiting list.) I encourage you to see someone who uses video appointments rather than just telephone or text. I see clients who are in all sorts of places: cars, trucks, garages, etc. As far as I know, all telehealth video platforms work with any phone with an internet connection.

Then, if you can--or if someone else can--try to convince your mom to see a therapist, too. (Ethically the same therapist could not treat you both, so there's your out.) This is all about her desperately seeking safety--her own.

You both deserve a better life. Sometimes it's hard to remember that the majority of the toxic and destructive behavior we see from others is born out of their own pain. That doesn't mean we ought to excuse it or put up with it; it just sometimes helps us to remember it. There are very few truly bad or evil people in this world, but there are billions who are in pain.

Therapy has changed a great deal over the years. A good therapist will not only help you develop insight, he or she will have some concrete tools to teach you so that you can find some immediate relief. And here's the big guilt gun: Remember, your children are learning how to be in the word from watching you. Finding a therapist is good parenting!
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MargaretMcKen May 2022
It would be nice to think that “the majority of the toxic and destructive behavior we see from others is born out of their own pain”, but is it true? There is absolutely no research I have ever heard of to prop this up. I suspect it’s crap.
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It appears your Mother has an unhealthy, unrealistic, dependant attachment to you.

Has she always been this way? Been 'obsessive' or anxious? Has this gotten worse?

Or is this new behaviour?

She will require some investigation into her mental health. Of course, you cannot make her do that.

What you CAN do is slowly increasing your privacy. And certainly a good therapist for professional advice & support. Many will have seen this dynamic before & don't judge.

I have a few small ideas for starters..
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Sounds like she’ll pout and cry no matter what you do. Let her! The crying is one of her many manipulation tactics. It’s no fun to see someone cry, but no one has died from crying.

Her behavior isn’t just weird; it’s bizarre and like a stalker. It’s a mental illness. If anything, stop letting her track you.
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Beatty May 2022
This sort of behaviour can creep up very slowly. So slow it is nearly invisable... Like the frog in the boiling pot.

If you have had an anxious Mother, you will have been trained by her from birth.

If knowing your every move keeps her anxiety at bay, this is how the entire family will behave. Tiptoeing around to prevent Mother's Meltdowns.

I agree it may look bizarre to a non-family member.
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Mother has stopped living her life. She is living YOURS. Or trying to.

The message you want to send is you have your own lives. You can come together at times, but it is healthy to have your own identities.

How you do this will be by repetition.

Small ideas for starters;

1. Practice being mindful over what you tell her. To what level. Start using broader brush strokes - just the headlines.

*Had lunch out* Rather than I had lunch at X time, in X cafe with X friend & ate X.

New clothing?
*Yes, I went shopping*, went wherever. Give less details.

2. Inform Mother your location app has been faulty. That you are finding it causes more anxiety than helping anyway. Then switch it off.

3. Calender chunking. Avoid 'haircut 9:30' as this leaves the rest of the day free in her eyes to 'book' you. Block out the entire morning, with *busy*. Be vague. Haircut, some errands etc.

Down the track you detatch her from your timetable completely.

Less is More!
Less info to Mother = more freedom to you.
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BurntCaregiver May 2022
Or keep the calendar in a drawer or out of sight somewhere else.
Inform mom that a tracker app will not be allowed on any phone that the OP is carrying.
Mother needs to be put in her place by her ADULT daughter.
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1. Consider changing your phone number.

2. Send your father to see a psychiatrist.

3. Plan your next vacation now and do not plan for your mother to attend.

4. Find yourself a therapist.

I agree that it's important to discern if this is "always" or "new" behavior. Your dad needs support in living with this level of dysfunction/personality disorder/ mental illness. If HE gets strong enough to set some limits, she may be frustrated enough to seek treatment.
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i have a mother who has a touch of this--nothing near as bad as what you're experiencing (i'm quite shocked at how far your mother goes) and for me i ended up moving 600 miles away to another state to cut the cord. i was single at the time though and it was easy to pick up and go, so it is likely not so simple for you with a husband and children. some others here are being quite blunt but they are correct that you cannot change her so you must change you. it is unfortunate that you gave in and ended your 'tough love' period, as that is the way it has to be. i understand how hard it is to hold the line, though--my mother just makes everyone miserable until she gets her way, so i do understand. but it must happen. help arrange therapy for her first (and you), but you need to go back to the tough love.
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I really don't get into the phone thing. I make calls and answer them. I have used the GPS and internet. Still use my big calendar in my fridge even though DD says "Mom, you have a calendar in your phone." I would like to know how someone can have excess to your calendar or know where you are without permission from you?

Your Mom should have had help long ago. This is not normal to want to be involved in your life to this extent. My one daughter lives 4 houses down from me and I don't see her every day. If I go down its for a reason. She tells her friends, kiddingly, I am nibby because I can see whats going on at her house but she can never claim I am clingy. When my girls see me calling or texting them, they know its for a reason. (My daughter chose to buy a house 4 doors down)

The norm is Mom and Dad showing up for your kids ballgames, school concerts and awards. Meeting your friends and leaving not inserting herself. This problem is your mother's. IMO she needs a Psychiatrist. You need a therapist to show you that you are not responsible for Moms happiness. A therapist to give you the tools needed to let Mom down easy. Getting her to understand that what she is doing is not normal is going to take time. Don't think she will be able to go cold turkey so your going to need to work together. Dad is going to be involved too. You may need to start out subtly. Like when she said you should have taken her shopping with you. Maybe you could have said "Mom it was a last minute thing and you really can't expect me to call you everytime I plan on shopping" If she says yes she can, just say "thats just not going to happen". It really isn't realistic.

The norm is you raise your children. Give them the tools to live in this world then you let them go. You hope they will keep you in their lives but they have their own lives to live. Its not normal to want to know what they are doing every minute. Once you and brother left home, your parents should have started planning on what they were going to do for the rest of their lives. Raising children is just a part of it. Your children are no longer the center of your life. Your parents are no longer the center of your life. The family you create is.

Your brother is the smart one in backing off. Or, Moms obsession is just probably with you. Boundries should have been set years ago. If she had a break down she would have gotten help long ago. Me, I don't do clingy. I probably would have moved away.

My MIL was passive-aggressive with a personality disorder. We got along the best when she moved a 2 day drive away and I only saw her 2x a year for a week. Your Dad is responsible for Mom, not you. And if he goes before her, please do not take her into your home even if the relationship improves.
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Just want to say, I am 72 and if I acted like this my 37 and 45 yr old daughters would not put up with it. I am not told what they are doing everyday. I am told they are leaving on vacation and when but hear nothing from them until they get home. (Always brought a goodie) Of course there is FB so I do see pictures. My oldest went by plane out of town for work. She texted to tell me she made it to the hotel. She has never done that.

I agree with Becky that less info given is the best. Don't tell her your going on vacation till your in the car on the way. Tell her you will call her when u get there and when u get home. Your vacation time is for you to get away and enjoy your family. And believe me if your Mom is like an Aunt of mine, she somehow gets the info out if you. You find yourself telling her things (and she is the last person u want to know the info) and then kicking yourself because you did it. You do not need to involve her in everything. She needs a life of her own and if you don't change the way you deal with her now, it will get worse as she ages and definitely if she becomes a widow.

Now that it was explained how she knows where ur, etc get rid of the app. Calendarwise, make up ur own shorthand so she can't decipher it. For example: FB yahoo, M 49, may mean for me, Facebook, my yahoo email, and my daughters name and a date of birth for password. You can unfollow Mom on FB. Don't have to delete her. By unfollowing you don't see her responses. Not sure if she no longer sees you. But they have no idea u have unfollowed them because ur still in their friends list. If she comments about not seeing your posts, tell her you have no idea why or that u don't go on much anymore. Put all your settings to private. May limit who she sees on your page.
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Confession: I am an only adult child in an enmeshed relationship with my 94-year old mother for whom I am the primary caregiver, but even in that she would never, ever, ever consider going to "my high school reunion." Your mom is exhibiting signs of a psychiatric disorder and you really do need to have some therapy as well as it is difficult (but not impossible) to extricate yourself from her grasp. You need to be away for even a bit and she needs to have her anxiety seen to. Your mom is young and it will not get better as she ages. You need to save yourself and help her before she becomes totally debilitated.
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BurntCaregiver May 2022
Or she needs to put her foot down with mom because she's an adult and does not have to allow this nonsense.
Mom can see to her own psychiatric needs by making an appointment with a psychologist. Her daughter does not have to do to it for her and hold her hand while she talks to the therapist.
Or both of them can give the TLC network a call and try to get on that show 'Smothered' which is about mother/daughter relationships like this. At least they will get paid for their dysfunction.
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