Obsessing about money. Any advice?

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Obsessing about money. Any advice?

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I have had POA for 18 months and handled my parents banking. In the last few months mom has been obsessed with money. There's no sitting down and explaining it to her, it's way over her head. In retrospect it's not just money. She has become argumentative about everything. It's this our new norm?

Alzheimer's & Dementia Dementia Behaviors Parents Power of Attorney (POA)

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Yes, in all likelihood, the new norm.
When I was POA and Trustee of Trust, having taken this on at my brother's request when he was diagnosed with probable early Lewy's Dementia, I had to keep track of every single penny into and every single penny out of his accounts in ANY case, so I made copies for him which he kept in a looseleaf notebook. He had been a meticulous organizer all his life and now had control over nothing. This makes our elders quite anxious and depressed. Not that he every really read anything, but my bro did know that he would get his monthly accounting, that he would every six months have an accounting of ALL ASSETS and ALL EXPENSES, and it was a great comfort to him that it was there, that he could see he had "enough". That he could see I was managing things as meticulously as he would.
As I said. You are POA. You have to do this ANYWAY. So why not supply her with a copy. (PS: don't include banks other than by code name nor account numbers or other identifying things.
Best of luck.
We understand that this all falls under a sort of paranoid thinking, but this happens to many many seniors, and your being upfront and organized will/can prevent a whole lot of anxiety.

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Most likely, yes. Giving mom copies of bank documents would likely cause more confusion and questions/angst than it would remedy. When my dad was no longer able to handle financial matters, I just took away ALL of the papers that were causing him so much turmoil and paid his bills for him. After he died, and mom's dementia got worse, she argued everything, and I mean EVERYTHING. There's no logic or explaining things to an elder with a broken mind, so she had nothing to do with finances at all. I handled everything, and if she needed expensive eyeglasses after breaking them, I'd tell her they were free and Medicare paid the entire bill of $1000, which wasn't true, of course, but it kept her calm bc she too was obsessed with money.

The name of the game with dementia is Keep Them Calm At All Costs. Divert their attention off the topic they're obsessing about, use therapeutic fibs to keep them calm when necessary, and have snacks on hand to keep them distracted.

I suggest you read this 33 page booklet which has the best information ever about managing dementia and what to expect with an elder who's been diagnosed with it.

Understanding the Dementia Experience, by Jennifer Ghent-Fuller
https://www.smashwords.com/books/view/210580

Jennifer is a nurse who worked for many years as an educator and counsellor for people with dementia and their families, as well as others in caring roles. She addresses the emotional and grief issues in the contexts in which they arise for families living with dementia. The reviews for her books are phenomenal b/c they are written in plain English & very easy to read/understand. Her writings have been VERY helpful for me.

Here is a list of useful tips from her e-book I found to be excellent:

The “Dont's”
· Do not reason and argue
· Do not demand that they reason or problem-solve
· Do not demand that they remember
· Do not demand that they get their facts straight
· Do not correct their ideas or scold them
· Do not reorient them
· Do not think that they are being uncooperative on purpose
· Do not think that they really do remember, but are pretending not to
· Do not use a “bossy” dictatorial attitude in care
· Do not act with impatience

The Do's
· Enter into their frame of reality, or their 'world'
· Be aware of their mood or state of mind
· Use few words and simple phrases
· OR use no words, just friendly gestures and simple motions
· Do everything slowly
· Approach from the front
· Wait for a slow response
· Constantly reassure them that everything is 'OK'
· Keep people with dementia comfortable 'in the moment' - every moment
· Maximize use of remaining abilities
· Limit TV or radio programs which they may feel are frighteningly real
· Maintain privacy
· Provide a safe physical environment

Best of luck.

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yes this is normal.

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It wasn’t until my husband took over all of my mother’s accounts (as a POA), did my mother stop OBSESSING about her money. CONSTANTLY.

Then, eventually, her dementia advanced to where she wasn’t concerned about money any longer. Now, her obsession revolves around getting meals, which she is convinced that she doesn’t get (not true!)

You’re in good company, here.

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I'm in the same place with my father's mail. Time to make it all go away.

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Yes, my Mom phoned my SIL once and told her I was stealing her money. Thankfully my SIL called me. I talked to Mom's doctor and she tweaked her sundowner meds a bit and I learned to tell Mom you have this much in banking acct, this much in investments, etc. Just hearing numbers helped her and she was satisfied. I didn't go into details, just gave flat $ amounts. I placed Mom in a dementia assisted living facility after living with me for 2 years. When she asks how much it costs, I just tell her that she has enough income coming in each month that it pays for her stay at the facility and for her incidentals and her investments and banking acct aren't being touched. She is satisfied with that.
I can say if it isn't finances, then it is her car (she hasn't driven in over 6 years and we sold her car 4 years ago). It seems she fixates on something for a time and then it changes. I have learned to just tell her what will keep her happy and then change the subject.

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Dementia has taken over, so this is not your mom's former personality or paying her own bills. You are doing the right thing handling her financial responsibilities as POA. Keep data to yourself and leave concerns away from your mom.

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You are right there is no explaining. You don't specify your mother's health issues but it sounds like she has dementia. I suspect this is a sign of her dementia progressing. Distraction is one thing that might help.

There are videos by Teepa Snow showing techniques for dealing with dementia patients. Here is a link to one of them. There are others. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MA9s2vZflw4

Wishing you all the best in this difficult journey.

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Wold it help to give a little fib and tell her that where she is living is a bargain? Tell her a rent amount that might have been from 20 years ago, back in her old reality of time. Or maybe move the decimal point

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Yes, this is normal. I just tell my mom not to worry and that I have taken care of everything.

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You could print out a bank statement and show her if it will help. But I have found with my father I’m not sure if he understands the difference between $5000 or $50,000 at this point. Some days yes, others not so much.

I took over the bulk of my dad’s finances last July when I found a bunch of unpaid bills and very overdue property tax bills on his rental properties. I do it all behind the scenes without him knowing as POA. He will NEVER willingly give up control of it. I had no choice but to be covert as when I would offer to help he would yell at me to stay out of it. To protect him I have to lie to him. It sucks, but this is ALZ. I started by putting a few on auto pay and then every month I would add another. Out of sight, out of mind. So far it’s working and I hope it stays that way for all our sakes. There are just a few left that his office manager writes the checks for and has him sign them, and I oversee all the accounts, business and personal.

Now I am starting the process of getting his business appraised (yes he still owns a business that his staff that has been with him for 35 years
is running, but he thinks he is running it) so I can list it for sale this year along with the commercial space he owns. As well as selling off a cabin he has has that he never goes to anymore. He will need this money for his care as I fear MC is about 8-12 months away. I’m thankful he has all of this so I will be able to place him a nice facility, but I have to make sure it’s there when he needs it and managing it all takes over my life many days.

It’s a lot. It’s like having a toddler in the terrible twos….but that toddler has money.

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I so relate to this. You’re doing incredible job. No one can appreciate the stress & work that goes into managing a loved one’s life & finances unless you’ve been through it.. It’s exhausting

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The issue is a lack of trust o God; not religion, but God.

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It isn't a 'new norm" - there is no overall 'normal,' when it comes to dementia.
There are certainly similar changes in the brain chemistry although the personality still comes through as everyone is an individual.

Do you know if she's been diagnosed? Without any information about your mom's condition, it is difficult to respond in ways that might support you. DO get everything legally needed set up if not already done.

This is important for you to be able to understand 'how' to communicate with her.

* Yes, people with dementia (or w/o it) will be argumentative. They are fearful. They are not functioning as they know (if they remember). They are loosing / have lost independence and this continues, along with their fears.

* They repeat themselves.
* They will not 'get it' when you explain - you need to STOP explaining as you have been and keep it VERY VERY simple - as below although adjust accordingly to be as truthful as possible while easing her fears:

"You have enough money to live on . . . " (or rephrase as needed).
"You are safe in your home and don't need to worry"

Shift to the present:

How are you feeling now? (She may not be able to answer this).
The key is to keep her in present time as much as possible.

Do not explain / redirect. [If you do not redirect or ease her anxiety somehow (ie. a foot massage, hold her hand, offer to go out for a walk), you will be in a never-ending loop of her repeating herself/ her fears / her anxiety - the only way she knows how.

"Yes, I understand you are concerned about XXX." I am taking care of everything / you. What would you like for dinner ... are you cold, do you want a sweater on? ... (somehow re-direct).

Gena / Touch Matters

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My Daddy was the same way about money. Why, because thats how we grow up, go to school so you can learn and get a good job to make money to buy what you need and what you want. Now, she has all the time in the world to focus on that. As someone stated earlier redirect her to a different subject, what are you watching, reading, crafting? What is the news saying about XYZ? Did you know that the moon is out tonight lets go look at it. The main thing is don't argue you will not win, and she will only frustrate you. Hugs and prayers

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Put down your end of the rope and walk away from the situation. How about meeting with an Elder Law Attorney and see if Mom can get a "court appointed" guardian and take yourself out of the equation. That should free up your relationship so that you can be a visitor instead of an abused caretaker?

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Yes. Obsessing about ______ (fill in the blank) has been a HUGE part of my mother’s dementia journey. She is CONSTANTLY obsessing about something. Early on, it was computer passwords. Then health issues. She “did research” online and convinced herself she had a new horrible disease every single day. Then it became obsession with her bowel movements. She takes photos of every bowel movement she has and shows them to EVERYONE, arguing endlessly that every single photo proves she is dying from some dread disease. (She is FINE.) Then a new friend in AL got her started on an obsession with getting a lawyer to sue her doctors and me for her “fraudulent” dementia diagnosis. Then that friendship broke up, and Mom went back to obsessing about bowel movements. The obsessions have nearly driven me around the bend. Like you said, there is NO sitting down and explaining ANYTHING. It does not work because memory and logic are just plain gone. No amount of reassurance or redirection or distraction works for more than a few seconds with my mom. It’s a “crappy” alternate reality she is living in.

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Doodles317: If your mother suffers from dementia, she unfortunately has lost the capacity for logical thought processes. I am so sorry. Prayers and hugs sent.

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I have been POA now for 2 years but the process of handling finances was gradual & like you and your LO it was a struggle. I created a list of bills (using the scan feature on my phone & would scan the bills as they would come in), once it's paid I share w/ my LO how I paid it (by phone, over the internet) Keeping explanations very simple has helped, early on I was attempting to share everything but I have learned simply explanations work best. If your LO is able, allow AND assist her with writing a bill or two out, it may help her feel like she's still in control. It's been helpful when I write the check info on a sheet of paper and then help my LO to write the check by pointing to what goes where (if needed).
Be encouraged, I am sure you're doing a GREAT job! And remember it's the disease, not your mom. As for a new norm - Yes, every day is and will be different - be sure to incorporate some self-care (ie meditation, aroma therapy, walking) we as caretakers must take care of yourselves also. Best of luck!

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My Mom obsesses over her money, doesn’t want to spend any. Wants to save so there is money left when she dies.
She is totally obsessed with her funeral arrangements. She calls the funeral home frequently to make sure all arrangements have been made to her wishes.
She is insistent that she takes care of filing her income tax herself. Her accountant encouraged her to continue to use his office and do it herself.
I take care of everything. In her mind my nephew takes care of her finances. She trusts him not me.
I could go on and on, I am sure I am not alone in my frustration. Lots of us are that person, the one who does everything but can’t be trusted to do anything.

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Money issues seem to be one of the first problems that arise with the onset of dementia. You don't have any information about your mum ad her health on your profile. I sympathize with being the one who does everything but can't be trusted to do anything. That is very well put.

Obsessing about money. Any advice?

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