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It was always impossible to suggest to my Mom that she do anything differently than the way she was doing it, even if her way was longer, harder. etc... Now that she has dementia she can be impossible to deal with. She is aware she forgets things. But if she does things that just aren't okay and you try to have a conversation she just thinks she is being lied to. If this was all "the disease" I could feel a lot more compassion. But I have been on the receiving end of this nastiness my whole life. Her illness has turned my life upside down. Fortunately for now she can pay for round the clock care except for a few hours when the night person leaves ( at 6:15) and a few hours before they come back at night. We live in a 4 family house, different apartments. So I am up at 4:30 every morning so I can have a little peaceful wakeup time before I go down to hear whatever crazy went on the night before. I really feel bad for what she's going through (or I would not have taken on the responsibility of being totally on my own as far as being the only person in charge of my Mom. But the nasty just takes a really hard situation and makes it so much worse. I could just use a few words of encouragement. There are no family or friends for that. My only support is from the people who get paid.

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The fact you have shared this shows how much you care and the horrendous effect our parents and dementia can have on us caregivers. My mum has suffered mental illness her whole life and now has dementia, advanced stage. She can be nice rarely but mostly is nasty, totally self absorbed and manipulative. People say oh well it's the dementia but she has always been the same, the dementia has just made it worse. She feels c...p all the time and wants others to feel the same. I feel constant guilt all the time for not actually liking her although I love her very much. My brother is very deep non communative person who on the surface, sees mum, but just gets on with his own life, seemingly unaffected by the situation. Any communication I make about mum is greeted with irritation. We had no choice recently to put mum into a care home after a long hospital stay as I could no longer cope even with carers help. The staff in care home are kind do thier absolute best but they find mum very difficult and I can see they don't like her much. I'm a grandmother myself and have now taken the decision to visit her, but less often and start to put myself and my husband first for the sake of our health which has started to suffer. I can hold my head high and know I've done my best and this is my advice to you. You can't change your mum her personality or her illness. Look after yourself before it's too late. Take care
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My mother is 92; she's always been narcissistic, mean & empathy/sympathy free. Now that she has dementia, the Mean Mom has become horribly mean and miserable 24/7. She speaks badly about everyone, including her own family members, and truly hates everybody in general. She used to put on the Nice face up until recently, and now that mask is gone. She's been 'under the weather' the past 2 weeks with a strained groin muscle, and showed up at a function today in the activity room at the Assisted Living Facility *ALF* where she lives. A friend told her she didn't look so good so mom freaked out, and told her, "Yeah, well YOU don't look so hot YOURSELF." There was a time she NEVER would have said such a rude thing, nowadays, all bets are off. She's always been difficult and hard to deal with, but now she's truly impossible. I'd like to believe it's all 'dementia' related, but the truth is, she has always been mean to the bone; now she's just meanER. I cut my visits short with her (especially after she told me that she always hated my late father because he 'never had sex with her', making her a 92 year old virgin? I was adopted.) and I get off the phone fast when she starts cutting my cousins apart. With a sharp knife. All in all, she's probably in better health than I am (at 61 years old), so only God knows how long this will go on. And on. AND ON. I really DO believe that their true colors come out when they have dementia......the ugliness they've always had inside just gets uglier, the harsh words just get harsher, and the intolerance towards others just gets even more intolerant.

All that said, I used to complain that the ALF charges her nearly $5k a month and nowadays I think it's CHEAP at the price. These people are paid to deal with her chronic BS, and so they do. Thank God for ALFs
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After reading the posts about seriously dysfunctional families I feel very lucky indeed as Mom never was rude or paranoid until the last two years of her dementia by the way at 86 yrs. well I suspect your body hurts so some of the discomforted behavior is allowed as well as being taken off her myelodysplasia
meds by the infusion center as she urinated in their lobby.....by the way I thought this was a bit sudden...as I asked isn't she going to die without your very expensive infusion shot???so I would like to say that my Mother and Father were respectively at 97 and 90 very agreeable people and in hindsight I dont know other than Dad didn't want anyone changing his diapers.....which is very understandable...………..I still think being naked without any diapers is the healthiest….given the germs and hands from other patients in the NH as well as
the area needs fresh air....do animals get UTI's...………...and Moma got paranoid after her$ 5000 shot for myelodysplasia was stopped given the chemicals in these injections as well as an article in NYT about myelo patients get dementia..
after these infusions well it is a debilitating no oxygen to the blood and brain I suppose so, as well as the mercury in the infusions...my parents were super
nice but were physically incapacited in the end, giving into UTIs and diarehea
but no manipulative behavior other than calling out for their caretaker Son, who died, suddenly exhausted with pneumonia and copd, at 69 years old waiting for the elder father at 97 to well die so he could move back into his house,sad,my brother looked after mom and dad for fifty years as they were uneducated immigrants and they enjoyed eachothers company in their restaurant...but I miss my brother who was resentful as his life was shortened...and I his sister would
eventually live with him.
prior...…...perhaps this is a story of caretaker burnout, and not taking you parent to NH..…...and the caretaker who is exhausted becomes sick with the flu and dies so this is sadder than a mean or crazy parent attacking you as he doesn't want strangers around....or has no money and thinks the kids will do all the work.
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If they were nasty to you when you were a child, when they come down with Alzheimer's were will just be put through a new level of abuse. They don't become more passive as adults except they become physically weak, so that if they were violent to you as a child you could likely now not have to suffer the physical abuse (because you are physically stronger now) but the mental abuse will just get worse. Also because they have need of you now at times, they will seek your help, and then just turn around and claim the 'victories' for themselves. They won't appreciate your help - don't ever seek thanks or recognition. My solution is to live as far away from them as humanely possible - i.e, other side of the planet. I always regret my contact with them. I come away feeling betrayed, abused and treated like an idiot. I also tell myself to never go back and subject myself to the abuse again. Yep. I wouldn't want to be in your situation living the same building with nasty parents who now have dementia.
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My mom has Alzhemiers and dementia almost 5 years ..my sister’s death really sped up the process ..she went through a nasty period but now she is very nice and cooperative...if she starts getting nasty either she is tired , in pain or has a UTI ,,,but she is really nice most of the time ,,says please and thank you and she appreciates all I do ...
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Emily,

For as long as I can remember, Mom has been negative, self-absorbed, controlling, and manipulative, with no empathy for others. She loves to say cruel things and watch her victims flinch with pain. She knows 101 ways to pit one family member against the other. She's no stranger to physical and emotional abuse. Sadly, dementia has only made it worse.

She's 93 and going strong. She's sweet and charming to people outside the family, but she treats us like c - - p. Amazing how, despite mid-stage dementia, her ability to discriminate is intact.

I've minimized contact and come here for emotional support. Only those who have walked through fire understand what it's really like.
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CantTakeNoMore Oct 2018
"She's 93 and going strong. She's sweet and charming to people outside the family, but she treats us like c - - p."

That's exactly it. It is amazing how Alzheimer's leaves that aspect of their psyche in tact even during the last years of their life. Agree 100%
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unfortunately in my mother and her husband case i think the answer is yes, absolutely, my mother was a very narcissistic and manipulative person and her husband a very tight and stupid one. they are living with me now, she still trying to create bad feelings towards her carers and me and, on rare occasion when my friends are visiting, she strip naked pretending to be fast asleep. on the other hand, her husband pass his time counting and hiding money and accusing us of stealing from him. still do`nt know how i manage not to put both in a care home. sorry, i am at the end of rope
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actually caring for my mother and her husband, both with dementia. mother been all her life manipulative and selfish. the hardest bit for me is to think that, somehow, they got away with what they did in the past because they cant remember. i know i should get over it but i still think its an injustice
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Dear Anne what a huge blessing. My Mother is probably in the end stages of dementia. She is hallucinating or just believing in a made up stories of her own making. A couple days ago she told my daughter that she had never been treated so badly by anyone. She accused her of inviting her out to dinner than disinviting her later. She kicked her out of her house told her she hated her and never set one foot back in her home. She never wanted to see my daughter again. This has completely broken my daughters heart. They have always had a very special and caring relationship. My daughters in her 20s but is so worried this will be my Moms last words to her. What a horrible disease this is. I feel completely lost and know this will only get worse and then she will be gone. It’s tragic!
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Having worked in a geriatric facility, behaviour can be the result of many factors. Some families said their loved one was the most gentle loving person who never got angry... Well maybe keeping the anger in all their life finally took it's toll because the dementia removes any filter they had been using...

My grand mother was the gentlest soul even with dementia. I remember our last conversation. I'd gone to visit her and she smiled so big at me,,,she couldn't remember my name but she knew that she knew me.. She said "I just love you".. I told her "I love you too" She passed a week later.
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I think the personality traits that have always been there just surface more without a filter if a person was mean and controlling before it just gets worse with dementia. I wonder how it is that she is able to remember her outburst but as always she is the victim.
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I think the personality traits that have always been there just surface more without a filter if a person was mean and controlling before it just gets worse with dementia. I wonder how it is that she is able to remember her outburst but as always she is the victim.
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My mom was distant and controlling when I was growing up. Right now, at 85 years old, I and my father and daughter felt it’d be a good idea to admit her to a Geri Psych unit to which she agreed to. We got the results today. Mom is depressed and has moderate dementia. She’s started new meds for that. I hope they help.
The new ‘fresh hell’ from her is she never wants to see my dad or I again because we put her in ‘that place’. So we’re praying we can get her a room in a very very nice assisted living home, hoping she’ll be happier.
She’s physically attacked my dad and is abusive verbally to my dad 24/7.
She’s going to put my dad in his grave if they aren’t separated.
So in my family’s case, once hateful, always hateful.
It’s very sad. She’s had everything she’s wanted in life but never been happy. At 17 years old I moved out of my parents house and it took me years to come to terms with this. But I have a happy marriage of many years and a great daughter. I vowed to stop the abuse cycle when I had my daughter.
I hope my mom can find some happiness at the end of her life but also, I’ll continue protecting myself and family from her cruelty.
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I think Dementia enhances their real personalities. I also think it causes them to have no censorship or filter. When my mother 93 goes into one of her aggressive rages, she calls my husband a drunken !#&!#. He has been sober for 25 years. I think it also brings out what she truly feels about things and people.
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Emily, I've asked myself the same question. I just acquired a book titled "Management of Challenging Behaviors in Dementia," 2000, by Ellen K. Mahoney, Ladislav Volicer, and Ann C. Hurley, that might be of interest to you. It's a study of the topic directed toward health care professionals. On page 24, it says: "There is some evidence that premorbid personality traits are related to subsequent psychiatric symptoms (Chatterjee et al., 1992). People who were neurotic and less assertive before developing dementia are likely to become depressed, whereas people who were hostile before developing dementia are likely to experience paranoid delusions. People who were neurotic and extroverted before developing dementia are likely to engage in aggressive behavior, whereas previous agreeableness decreases the probability of aggression (Van Cauter et al., 1998)."

Granted, it's an older study, but take or leave as you will, the book is interesting. Wishing you the best as we share our common struggles.
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I had a nurse once tell me that my mothers abusive and sometimes violent behaviour was the true person and thst dementia brings out the 'real person'. I thought she was an absolute idiot and that kind of information should be kept to herself as it is totally false. I proceeded to ask her how many times has she nursed a person with dementia for more than a few hours per day? She thought this was an unusual question and answered that she 'just pops in' on people for her usual 20 min visits. I told her not to come to our house again and she needs to find another illness to visit if thats what she believes. I have given up 10 years of my life to look after the most beautiful loving kind generous person i will ever know...my mother...Brigid...she is at her final stage of dementia and i would do it all again in a heartbeat. It has been an honour to look after her...in the good times and the very bad times.
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anonymous806474 Nov 2018
Perhaps you should respect the caretaker as much as u appreciate your Mother and taking care of her....jumping to conclusions..why was caretaker at your house anyway...u see its all generalizing,,,yes people are difficult and iam happy you are so forgiving and unselfish in your caretaking,,do you have a housekeeper?..i mean everybody has different circumstances....financial
situations relieve people from those who dont..and just have to deal with their guilt and no financial help/I just received the bill..Medicaid..not free...
misinformation....at least total for march-july 21...….10,000 my dads social,
Medicaid bill arrived for PAYBACK 13,000, 6000.00 FULL PRICE SNH..
29,000 FOR Dad whom I put in harms way should have kept him home
and brought in caretakers!!!!!what is the point of applying for Medicaid and getting down to 2000 in yr bank account if during the time u apply you get charged full price NH 7000 per month..ITS A SCAM...AND
ENTRAPMENT IM NOT GONNA PAY THIS BILL..FRANKLY THE nh WAS below par,,,many people there had their own caretakers or sitters that they paid..ok enough its called Medicaid payback in your state there is a term...for it...what are all the lawyers for in preplanning...seems the only way to survive...……….is to have Long Term Healthcare Insurance..most do not!
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My geriatric consultant (well Mums obviously .....not mine!) said that any small traits they may have had prior to dementia get exaggerated and magnified with dementia - both good and bad. he also noted that sometimes the bad override the good - truer words never spoke in my case.
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I agree with what AmyGrace wrote about loss of inhibitions. People (and other animals) have complex brains with many different control areas. Someone can have a thought or emotion, but it can be dampened or snuffed by input from control areas. For example, a person can be frightened by something, but input from other areas will let the person know that there is no threat after all. They calm down quickly. Or a person can get miffed at a slight incident. Input from control areas against would say there was no threat and the anger is eased. But what if these control areas are damaged, or if the links between the areas of the brain are severed?

We are most likely still seeing parts of the person they've always been, but with the partial loss of higher control that comes from neural feedback.
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Like kizzie, that is what we experienced with our Mom. She gave my sister a harder time than me (but still argued big time with me until I learned you can't reason with dementia) I'm not sure dementia makes them more like they always were. There were a lot of behaviors (phobias, lack of self control, selfishness, obsessions) Mom developed that were never there when she was younger (I think they came from frustration and anger at loss of independence). Other personality traits did become more enhanced, such as stubborness and negativity and narcissism, but that was probably from the loss of inhibitions when dementia robs them of their normal emotional self control.
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My mother's always been very independent and strong-willed and the Alzhiemers has only enhanced it. I've noticed that she will be extremely difficult with my sister and me yet kinder and more cooperative with her part-time caregiver. I asked her one day why she give me such a difficult time when I've put life on hold trying to take the best care of you possible. Her response "I know the doufalous". I guess if you have to lash out for unfair hand life has dealt you, you do it with the people that are gonna love you regardless. It's extremely frustrating but I understand.
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My mother was always a sweet, gentle and caring person also. Dementia changed her into someone we barely knew. She became stubborn, self obsessed and in the last couple of years sometimes agitated and angry. It was the disease that changed her, that and the fear and frustration she felt about losing her independence and people telling her what to do. Some of her more negative personality traits (like being stubborn, fidgeting, obsessions) came out more as she lost her ability for self control. She even struck out physically a couple of times, which was not my mom at all. Dementia is a disease and I guess affects everyone differently.
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Being alone in dealing with your relative's dementia is really difficult. I enjoy AgingCare...reading the various issues in various stages of the disease that people are dealing with, asking questions, answering questions I've already dealt with. Keep reading what everybody has posted, you can learn a *lot*. I also believe that dementia accentuates baseline personality factors. Personality traits like being manipulative and scheming seem to be enhanced with dementia. And can change one second to the next. To quote my mother when I was in trouble as a teen: "You made your 'bed of roses' now you can damn well sleep in it." I certainly treat her far better than she treated me. I will have no regrets when her time to pass comes.
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Maggies dad nailed it! My father was always mean spirited, brutal and violent in his punishment. At 94,,,,,,,nasty one day, level the next, like walking across a minefield. Everything is someone elses (usually me) fault. To answer your question, yes, it is a mix of both personality flaws and the disease.....dementia adds the paranoia and in my case....a reality that can be conjoured up inside the mind....resulting in many accusations and outbursts.

Please do not think as this progresses you can do it all by yourself. This is the hardest thing you will ever do in your life. There is no shame in bringing outside help or sending her to the pro's. Ask the doc for an antianxiety drug. Celexa has performed miracles for us.
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My dad, God rest his soul, had a saying I'll never forget:

"You know that 80-year-old man who's such an *******? The one you excuse for his behavior because he's old? Well, he was most likely an ******* at 30."

I think, for the most part, dad was right.
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C
CantTakeNoMore Oct 2018
Thank you.
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Please look up the term "Sundowning" as it is an actual and common occurrence in elderly dementia patients. My mother had the condition pretty badly and was becoming combative so we had to see a geriatric psychiatrist who prescribed Ativan which has allowed my mom to regain her more pleasant personality and social skills. However, she still has much more confusion and disorientation after 3:00 PM regardless of the medication.
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I am so with you. Hugs. Our 95-year old is spiteful, coarse, and cannot be told anything. Never could be guided in any way. The AL center has had her a week and has called us in to meet with them tomorrow...they've never seen anything so narcissistic, so much rage. She's threatened all her new caregivers, apparently. She's always had her way, due to her abusive ways, and the dementia has just distilled her bile. What do we do now? I, too, have lost so much of my compassionate self, because you can only be pelted with the stones of life so much. Love to you, and to me, and pray we make it.
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Emily your story is the same as my own. My mother was always a nasty piece of work until very recently ... now she's close to 90, in a NH, bed ridden, barely able to speak and her mind is away with the fairies. She is coming close to the end of her life now.
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My experience is with my Dads mild to moderate dementia. He was always easy going and still is pretty much. He seems to know that he forgets things but has no idea how bad his short term memory is. The biggest change I see in him is the total, unfounded stubborness with any reasonable suggestion. He just is stuck on certain things like refusing to get the filthy carpet cleaned or agreeing to any help whatsoever. And if you push the issue even mildly he will lash out. This is new behavior him.

I have to work really hard not to get mad at him and remember it's the dementia.
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I think that's true in the earlier stages, you can't really expect a tiger to change their stripes, and once some of the social filters start to slip more of their hidden personality traits start to show through.
I have, however, also read of people that were little sweeties becoming angry and violent (although this is often related to pain and confusion), of introverts becoming more out going ,of angry types becoming mild mannered, etc. I think that as the disease progresses we may forget the life lessons that have formed our personalities and perhaps become more of our true selves???
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