My parents have been married over 60 years. My mother has been unhappy for most of that time. She has been caregiving for my dad. Dad is frail, with limited mobility but can get around with a walker. Mom is Type A personality. Dad is basically a hen-pecked husband. Mom had reached her limit and asked Dad to ask me to take him for 2 weeks which I did. I flew to their state, my sister who lives locally took Dad and I to the train station, we traveled 22 hours by train to my state and then did the reverse to get him back home (Dad won't fly). There were challenges, but my Dad is an easy-going guy, appreciative and loving.
I haven't been home for 48 hours and Dad says Mom wants out. She enjoyed her 2 weeks off and doesn't want to caregive anymore. She wants out, as in divorce.
I don't know what to do. Should I call a social worker to find out what our options are? Do we wait for Mom to leave? Side note, Mom and I have a rocky relationship right now, she doesn't communicate with me. I found out how serious things are with Dad while he was here, things I wasn't aware of the seriousness - like his fine motor skills and eyesight are very poor. She always says he has dementia, and his short-term memory is really bad, but he is a walking encyclopedia when it comes to history, books, politics and things that he is interested in, we can have completely normal conversations. He just can't remember where he left his jacket 5 minutes ago. So having had a mother-in-law who really did have dementia, I don't feel like Dad is there at all.
Mom has been a very good caretaker for Dad physically, but has become very emotionally abusive to him. I can't fix the dynamics of their marriage - I can't force my mom to stay when she's so miserable.
What would be a good first step for me to take? Thank you for reading.
Let your Dad know if he wants a pre emptive seperation and placement away from this woman, that he should let you know. Stay in contact with Dad.
Every relationship is unique. This is just another one. I think it unlikely Mom will leave. If she does, good riddance.
The last place an adult child belongs is in the middle of their parents' martial squabbles. Because it sounds like you've been there your whole life, you might consider speaking to a social worker or counselor yourself. (Went back and read your other posts about Mom's depression, passive/aggressive behavior AND that you have sought therapy--Yay!)
Although you say that dad is easy-going and appreciative, beware of the idea of moving him into your home if he decides to leave mom. Will he consider the idea of moving to an Independent Living Facility or Senior Apartment where he can be around more peers?
If it were my parents and they were 10 years or more younger than they are now, I'd probably step away and let them sort it out. But they have to be in their 80s or more, right? And then you'll probably still feel compelled to help your Dad no matter what because he seems more helpless. Maybe your mom just needs someone to take Dad off her hands and assure her that a divorce is simply a legal formality that will be costly and complex and have no other benefit other than mental for her, so why not leave things as they are and just solve the most pressing issue for her, which is what his future care will be? I'm not judging whether to step in or back, just being practical and suggesting that your mom may not have it all together like you think, especially since everyone lives so far from her -- you don't really see the day-to-day mom.
Left on her own would your mom be capable of carrying through finding and engaging a divorce attorney, finding all the financial and investment and other paperwork, paying for the cost...etc.? Who's going to help your Dad move out and where will he go? I think "stepping away" = allowing mom to create a hot mess that will still require intervention and induce family anxiety in the end. A social worker won't have any power if neither of them have a medical diagnosis of dementia.
Is anyone PoA for either parent? Has your mom ever had a cognitive exam or checked for a UTI recently? The older people get, the more "stuff" can change on a weekly or even daily basis. Before assuming your mom is just a busy little bee who wishes to be independent once dad's care is decided, I'd make it a point to have her assessed so that everyone has context for making future decisions.
- We beg her to get help with housekeeping and caregiving. Her answer is No.
- We suggest she join a caregiver's support group. Her response is "I don't want to sit around with a bunch of people who are complaining about caregiving."
- I gingerly suggest she see a counselor, I get back a firestorm of "You are the one with the self-esteem problems, I don't need anything like that."
And you are right, there is nothing I can do right now that is acceptable to her.
She is very private. She is somewhat (IMO) paranoid. She hasn't phoned me in over a year. I stopped calling her because she was emotionally abusive when I did speak to her (icy, rude), but I do send cards and notes letting her know I'm there if and when she wants to talk.
No, neither my sister or I are POA. That's another mess. Last year Mom went ballistic because I didn't bring it up (Sorry, but I assumed it is there responsibility to ask me, if that was wrong, so be it). Then when I try to reassure her I am willing to discuss, she gets angry and says that she's getting a fiduciary. This past week, Dad asked me if my sister and I would be co-executors of their wills - I had to tell him about mom's outburst the last time the subject came up, of which he knew nothing - but told him "Yes, absolutely, I'm sure Sis and I will be able to do this together." He said he was going to talk to Mom about it.
Mom is so prickly about EVERY single thing that it is difficult. They have the same GP. I asked Dad, "Have you thought about telling the doctor about stuff that's going on at home? Maybe he can do a cognitive test on Mom without mentioning you are the one that brought it up." Dad was "No, that will push her over the edge. She'll know I suggested it" I don't know where to go with this.
My way of being with my parents was to wait until I was asked for something. If I was asked, I could then set some limits around what help I was willing to give.
This is opposed to "swooping", a bad habit that ALOT of us have.
What has mom "asked for"? Is she asking for you to "take" dad? Does she think he is your responsibility? Is she asking for help with establishing her own household?
You have indicated in the past that you and mom have a pretty fraught relationship. Be prepared for NOTHING that you do is right.
What does DAD want?
Do you think that either of your parents would listen to a mediator or social worker? How about you ask them if they'd like you to arrange for a divorce mediator to come to their home and talk to them. Would that help, or would that be yet another piece of assistance that mom would reject?
You and your sibling need to have a serious conversation with your mother and lay all the cards on the table. Speak in plain language and make it understood that neither of you are going to take over the caregiving for your father and he will not be moving into either of your homes. If this is not an option you or your sibling is offering, your mother must be made aware of it. It seems to me like this is exactly what she wants and is waiting for you or your sibling to bring it up. Your mother very likely wants to stay legally married and wants to keep your father out of a care facility because she doesn't want her own standard of living or income to decrease if your father goes into AL, or MC, or even senior independent living. She wants everything to stay the same, but only with your father living somewhere else that also comes with free caregiving services.
Tell her to grow up. It's not up to you or your sibling to fix your parents' lives. You and your sibling can discuss care options for your father, but keep a bit of a distance though. Ultimately it will be her decision if she wants to get divorced at her age.
Yeah, I don't know what she wants because she won't discuss anything with me. I know you are right, my sister and I need to present a united front and be direct. I dread the circular conversation that will ensue. But we at least have to try before we bring in a social worker/mediator type person.
Geaton and BarbBrooklyn,
Thank you for thoughtful and detailed constructive responses. You've given me lots to think about. I think I'm going to check in with Dad tomorrow, see how he's doing. Sister is taking him out to lunch on Weds. It probably does me no good to get all worked up tonight from 1000 miles away. Mom could change her tune in the next 48 hours, who knows.
In my heart the best thing is to get them away from each other. How to do that is the hard part. I know Mom will not want to talk about money, while Dad has already shared approximately what is available, letting me know "Don't tell your mom I told you this"... ugh.
This has been one, big, huge lesson in what not to do to my kids.
But this is your marriage. If you want out, think it through.
What do you really need?
More temporary breaks? Where Dad stays in respite for 2 weeks at a time? Or weekly breaks where Dad goes to adult daycare.
Or maybe you do want out for good (ie divorce).
Use this time Dad stays with me to look into your options. Properly.
Find a therapist & start discussing what your future life will look like. Find a social worker to help take the steps needed. Find an elder legal service to assist with legal/financial matters.
This is your marriage & your responsibility.
Dumping Dad on your kids & walking away is NOT the way. Got it?
I can help you find the help you need but I will NOT be your solution.
How's that?
Let one of them initiate a divorce or separation or a move out. If Mom moves out or initiates divorce or separation then support Dad. Until then, I'd let them figure out their own marriage.
It does sound like Mom is one of those people that complain about everything and will never be happy with anything. I also suspect she will never move out.
It reminds me of a friend's Dad yrs back. Was dealing with serious health issues of his wife. "We're fine, she's fine, I'm fine, no don't need any help". Had a successful career, could manage right?
Except he was NOT fine & he DID need help. The burden of care was stretching over many years. He did not know how to say it or find it. Was overwhelmed & burning out.
As Geaton pointed out, his marriage vows 'in sickness & in health' was his strong moral code. Add in the strong religious belief to put others before you, then add that 'I am a sucessfull manager' personality & ... he coped & coped until one day... Boom! He lost it.
Put wife in the hospital & drove to all adults kids homes (spread all other the state) to announce his wish for divorce.
Shock & more shock.
What happened next was having Mother somewhere cared for & safe, then counselling for Father.
He then SAW he could actually continue by accepting the HELP he had long denied.
That story ended with a lovely couple still married till the end, getting the support they BOTH needed.
Now for the OP's folks, they may stay together or maybe not. Maybe they both could reach a better level of happiness apart? Marriage counselling is good for those situations deciding on joined or separate paths.
So rather than try to *fix* the folks marriage or *swoop* in to save Dad - point them both towards a qualified marriage counselor service.
As my DH (bluntly) tells his family members "I am not your shrink" 😄
Tribe, your folks are lucky to have you in their team. But you don't have to be the Coach.
Find out about all the local resources for your dad near you.
Make an appointment to have your dad tested for dementia and other chronic health problems. Ask the doctor about what kinds of help your father will need.
Start making plans for your dad to either live with your full-time... or his moving into a long term residential facility.
Do you think your father would do better if your mother weren't his primary caregiver?
Has he said what he wants?
She may have caregiver burnout (caregiving can't have helped, for certain) but she may also have marriage burnout. A long time coming, but maybe better late than never?
If they *both* want out, why not? They should see a lawyer together, and find out what's possible. The important thing is to take blame out of the equation: they aren't good together, so what else can they do is the only question that matters.
Find the right kind of lawyer, then ask if they both want to take counsel, and if so give them the contact details.
Just so you know, there are Divorce Mediators--generally they are lawyers with social work degrees. They can be very effective at helping couples who want to split up come to an agreement about dividing assets and the like.
I went through this process in ending my first marriage; we agreed about almost everything until we came to a sticking point about the division of his 401k. We negotiated back and forth until it was clear that he wasn't accepting anything except HIS vision of how it should be divided. The mediator/lawyer called in a psychologist who also could see no way around his intransigence (and mine, asking for what I knew I should get, according to NYS law).
She then advised us to retain "mediation friendly lawyers". I did (they are generally much less expensive than lawyers who litigate).
Mine told me to stand my ground; his explained to him, at $600 an hour, what the mediator and I had told him NYS law said about division of assets.
It all worked out. In your shoes, I think you and your sister should get some referrals from JAMS (that's the big mediation organization) and send them to your parents.
If mom wants a divorce, the ball is in her court.
Please be aware that if there are limited assets involved, you/they need to be very mindful of Medicaid regs. Mom may want to divide assets in a certain way that is totally contrary to the "best" way to do things. If mom is going to be obdurate and not listen to advice, then she needs her own lawyer to represent her best interests.
I understand that you love both of your parents, but it sounds as though your dad is the one who needs care and who is being abused by mom. He may need someone to represent HIS interests so he can get the care he needs.