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Babalou, Enjoyed your post about your Irish grandmother and her reaction to 'rehab' and your comments in general. There was no army of PTs, OTs, PTAs, OTAs, and SLPs in my grandmother's day (b. 1882). No hip or knee replacements or modern-day meds. Our generation is being asked/expected to step up on an unprecedented scale. And I agree with others here who have said that most of our own parents never had to do what we are doing, nor would they probably if confronted by such a situation. When my parents married, only one of their parents was still alive, and my parents moved an hour away and placed that parent in an apartment. They visited regularly, but did not provide 24/7 oversight. That parent died of pneumonia in a nursing home after a very brief illness. So by year #8 of my parent's marriage, they were on their own. They never had to bathe their parents, administer meds, empty bed pans, change diapers, etc.

My mom has been in rehab on 3 separate occasions; post-kyphoplasty, post-wrist fracture, post-UTI. And every time I am in those places I witness the daily marches to and from the physical therapy room. A percentage (often the younger ones) go gladly; but some look reluctant or resigned; and some don't want to go at all and say so. Our society does not allow people to slow down at a time in life when many folks don't have a grasp on reality anymore. They are just getting through each moment. They wake up in the a.m. and think 'OK, I'm still here.' Or some don't/can't think at all, don't know where they are. They go with the flow, whatever it may be, because they have to. When I think of my mom's life (91 and still mentally 'here', and thankfully, a sweetheart who is grateful for what I do for her), I don't think I would want it for myself---dependent on everybody. I am still relatively young, but am looking into LTC insurance.

As some here have said, many of today's seniors have outstanding medical care in contrast to younger generations. My mom has fantastic insurance while my husband and I have a 10K deductible. She sees an army of doctors 25-30 times a year. We may go once a year, if that. Will our generation make it as far as our parents? Will we want to? And if we do, will the same level of support be there? Personally, I don't think so. Upcoming generations are very self-absorbed and our media, and society in general, encourages that. I joke with my husband about making sure we have an 'escape plan'. But maybe it's no joke!
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This whole section makes me sick. I am 70 and have taken care of my parents and my brother in law an now my husband because I love them. It was not what was expected. It was offered by me to be their caregiver. I have survived it all while at the same time teaching for 43 years. I had to retire three years ago to care for my husband who is now getting end stage of Alzheimer's. What ever happened to generosity and love of parents? I can't believe how selfish and self absorbed you all sound! I think when you are this old you will be very surprised at what happens in your senior years and you are the one needing care. At age 70 I am completely well and active and I feel this part of my wedding vows. That I would love and cherish until death do us part. I plan to care for my husband for as long as I can physically do it. No one helps me except for friends who call me and meet me occasionally for lunch or dinner. It is true the older generation has more compassion than the selfish "ME" generation. I know I will get a lot of flack about this but I don't care. I am doing the best I possible can for my elders and my beloved family! If you have a hateful parent, then I would not do for that parent. Just don't do it!
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wamnanealz, you won't get any flack here for your compassion and love for your family. I think that mutual respect is what makes the difference in families. The caregivers who are not being respected by parents and siblings seem to have the hardest time. You seem to have that respect within your family.
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I think they lose track, or lose perspective, when their consciousness becomes drawn inward by illness, pain, loss of mental facilities. Fierce independence gets pushed aside by fear and need. My aunt had planned for years, even built an addition onto her house for a future caregiver, but by the time she needed it she couldn't deal with having a stranger live their and giving it up as her space. She wouldn't pay for help, but she would give money away freely to people she felt grateful to. We had to hire help and tell her it was covered. She repeatedly talked about how she needed no one and her grandsons were too far away and she wouldn't bother them, but then would talk about how they didn't care. I stayed for 6 months since I am retired, her grandsons chipped in and finally found a situation that suits her, thanks to the an available and willing family friend. BUT.. there is the very real danger of someone taking advantage of these needy and trusting folks. As with my aunt, a "Friend" can reinforce her feelings of abandonment, convince her he is her ONLY real friend, and then reach deep into her pocketbook. He told her over and over that her family didn't care and he was her only friend. It is important to find the balance between giving a person support, maintaining your own life and health, and leaving your loved one vulnerable to the even more narcissistic predators who can and will take advantage.
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My parents are 90 and my sisters and I take turns taking care of them. My parents took care of my mother's mother when she got old and infirm. The rest of my grandparents died younger and more suddenly. My grandparents took care of their parents. I think in many families this is the norm, and so it is the expectation.

You also have to keep in mind that assisted living is a relatively new concept, as are retirement communities where relatively healthy people live among those who need more care. In my parents' experience, you took care of yourself, then your kids took care of you, and once you need a nursing home you're going to die pretty quickly. They dread going to a nursing home. Assisted living wasn't even on the radar because they don't really know what it is. At this point, they aren't candidates for that either. There are a lot of days we are tempted to put them in a nursing home, but frankly, it is so expensive and they just don't have the money. So we will care for them at home until we just can't do it any longer. The least expensive nursing home in their area would cost $54,000 per year for just one of them. My cousin had to put her FIL in Alzheimers care and it was $100K annually.

I agree with others that the elderly seem to be living longer, and medical science has certainly made it possible to live with ailments that would have killed a person a generation ago. Some elderly people I know take 20 - 30 prescription meds every single day. (My parents each take 3.) But I know that my folks expected us to care for them because they cared for their folks and the previous generation did too.
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JessieBell, ah yes "mother's little helper" pills.... and I remember when my Mom was feeling a bit under the weather, her doctor would take her hand and place his hands on her hands and say "Now, now, dear, why don't you go out and buy yourself a new hat. That will make you feel better". Imagine if a doctor today said that to any one of us :P
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wamnanealz, one has to remember that not every case is the same. Some of us are senior citizens with our OWN age decline health issues who are trying to help in some way for much older parents.

I am pushing 70 myself. Glad to read that you are still fit. Five years ago I was a gym rat, hiked in the woods, was very healthy, worked full time at my career then wham cancer hit, took me totally by surprised, surprised my doctors, had zero warning and had no markers saying it would happen. That in itself was a huge game changer. Now I can barely walk a mile where in the past my sig other and I would hike 20 miles on a weekend.

So instead of me retiring early to travel the world since I don't know when the cancer will return, what I am doing is overseeing the care of my parents who refuse to move into a retirement village [this isn't a nursing home nor assistant living, it's like living at a 5-star resort] which would give them MORE freedom then they have now. And give me MORE freedom to try to resume my life. Would I walk away from my parents, of course not. I try to help the best I can. But it can be emotionally draining.

Thank goodness for this website to help with my sanity and to share information. We all need to vent once in awhile.
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Wow....my sis and I thought we were the only ones with parents that expect us to put them first in our lives.....no matter our health, children, grandchildren and great grandchildren. I had a mental breakdown and have been recovering for two years. My parents are devorcied. I am the only one of 6 kids that has anything to do with dad. He never took care of any of us so I can't really blame them. I am mentally worn out with dad. I am an hour and a half away from the nursing home and get 3 or 4 calls from him each and every day. Always something he wants me to do. I am exhausted. My sister lives in another city and has a similar situation with my mother. I pray I do not do this to my children.
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My father would say that he didn't need us, but in his deep dementia he did not realize all we were doing for him. He insisted on living at home, alone, after my mother died, and would not remember to eat, drink, take his meds, or even that she had died. So my brother and I HAD to be there for him three times a day. He INSISTED that he would know when he should stop driving (and he was mean and angry about that and other things), but I was frantic that he would not give up his keys and might hurt someone. When his car battery died, that was a great gift to me! I guess what I am trying to say is that even when your 91-year-old parent says he will be fine all alone, and says he does not need help, and needs to go live in assisted living, we really needed to be there for him, day in and day out. He would not have accepted any strangers in the house, and we had to trick him to get him into memory care. After years of dealing with him and his needs, and worrying 24 hours a day, we finally got to heave a sigh of relief and start to live our own lives again. He died in November, after only 3 months in memory- and long-term care, and there is nothing but relief in my mind, and that of my co-caretaker brother. His dementia was not his fault, but that didn't make our lives any easier to take.
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My mother, 103yo worked until she was 99 and had a vegetable garden from which she fed all of us until a stupid doctor didn't diagnose hyperthyroid condition. She had to come live with me after a stroke, but she doesn't have that sense of entitlement. Sometimes she gets pushy about something that is out of the question and I'm firm about my boundaries. I tell her that I'm doing all I can do and I can't do any more than that and she steps back. When I was a kid she looked after both my grandmothers in our little 3 bedroom house and I slept on the couch when my father came home on weekends. Both those grandmothers expected to be cared for. I think it's a mind set. My mother told me all of my life that "every pot must sit on its own bottom." meaning that everybody had to take care of themselves. She now pays a caregiver to help us out.
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I feel for you freqflyer, and admire your devotion to your parents. The ironic thing is that they would probably be very happy in the 5-star retirement village if they'd give it a chance. Do they ever express concern over your health? Could they try a couple weeks of 'respite care' just to try it out? After all, what would happen if you weren't there for them? Sounds like you should be caring for you right now, but you can't. That's tough. And, wow, sherry1anne, 103yo mom--that's amazing. I like your mom's 'every pot' expression. Never heard that one. She sounds like a wise woman. You, too. I think you're right that the expectation to be cared for is a mindset. And in many ways there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. In an ideal world, families should be tight-knit and take care of all their members. And most seem to do that, and that's a beautiful thing to see. From reading this forum, however, it strikes me that narcissistic parents (subject of this thread) and dementia are issues that push caregivers over the edge and take the biggest toll. I don't know what to do about the former other than to walk away if it becomes unbearable and health-threatening. As for dementia, when it strikes, worlds come crashing down. I hope and pray that science finds a cure soon so that minds start catching up with bodies in terms of longevity, a situation that would bring relief to so many and give hope and more peace to those approaching their senior years.
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The whole time I was growing up, my mom had to take care of my grandmother who lived next door. My mom was one of 10 but the burden all fell on her. She always said she would never do that to us (I am one of 7 children.) However, when it became apparent she could no longer take care of herself, I stepped in. We were fortunate she was able to hire help and then, later, an assisted living facility. I think how much involvement you (the child) has is up to YOU. You don't have to be their doormat. Obtain as much help as you need without sacrificing your life. When you think about it, aren't a lot of you acting like martyrs? Grow a backbone and set some limits! We are fortunate we live in a society that will take care of our elders when we can't.
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Many of our parents were working when social security and Medicare taxes started being taken from their incomes. At the time I'm sure these taxes were sold to the public as "future benefits/investments". This no doubt is where the "entitlement" mindset comes from. I'm sure president Roosevelt had no idea what a twisted mess this program would become.
This once noble program has been bastardized into a monster which supports a multitude of industries and money mongers of all kinds. So called "medical advancements" and Hippocratic Oaths have us living well past any semblance of quality, merely milking the Medicare cows for all they and we are worth as individuals and taxpayers.
A DNR order can be signed but means very little unless Hospice is involved. Hospice also makes a hefty income from Medicare so a vicious circle is achieved. In any case, we are no longer allowed to die with dignity and our parents have had this sense of entitlement engrained into them from the onset of the program. If a parent happens to be a narcissist it serves to fuel their overinflated opinions of themselves.
In short, the monster started back in the 1940s as part of a noble reform effort.
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What my mother told me: "I put my money in." (referring to social security and Medicare taxes).....to which I had to reply: "Mom, the money you put in over a lifetime maybe paid for one week at the hospital."

They really don't get it!
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The sad thing is that there in logic in what she says. We work hard over a lifetime, but healthcare costs are so high that they are taking a large percentage of the money made by people and paid in taxes. I would love to see the country effectively lower, or at least control, the cost of healthcare so that people could live out their lives without worrying.
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My mother has been a totally self absorbed narcissist with delusions of grandeur life long. We've never been close and I spent a lifetime avoiding her if possible. After her mother passed she refused to care for her father as it would be "too much trouble and I'm not washing his dirty underwear". The old man could be difficult but he was able to walk, bathe and see to himself ... all she'd have to do was feed him and do laundry.

When she could no longer manage alone (parkinsons, strokes and increasing dementia), purely out of duty, I sold my home, quit my career and moved 200 miles to live in her gloomy freezing basement and care for her. Her condition deteriorated rapidly. Four years later, after a bad fall and a spell in hospital it was evident I could no longer care for her alone (and she wouldn't allow anyone else in the house) so she went to a NH.

That was over two years ago and she's spent those two years in her room ranting, raging and planning where she's going to move to ... either with me (impossible) or some five star type resort facility where she'll be waited on hand and foot (which doesn't exist). A year ago, on the edge of a breakdown due to her daily screaming calls, I had a blackout driving my truck at 85 so I changed my phone number and made it unlisted.

When I visited yesterday she'd decided she'd go live with Joan. Joan, a long ago acquaintance, visits a couple of times a year, is in her 80s, has a sick husband, grown children, dogs and an active social life {rolling eyes}. She also wants me to get her a whistle because the NH staff don't run immediately when she pushes the buzzer for assistance ... assistance in opening her apple juice or something {again, rolling eyes}. Visiting sucks the life out of me and I mentioned I feel like I might be getting a cold, priming her not to expect me for a while, and I'll drop her stuff at the office for her ... always has to have more and more "stuff".

Her dementia is pretty much full blown, she can no longer sit up or stand, is incontinent and has no friends. Though she had all she ever wanted (it was never enough),,having spent her life fantasizing and desperately reaching for more, more, more she will continue in that mindset until the end which, frankly, is not far away. All I can do is ensure she has all she needs and distance myself for the sake of my own health and sanity. I've done my duty.
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As for my aging parents and for me, this is all new unchartered territory for both of us as to what to do.

As I think back, no one in either side of the family ever took care of their parents under the same roof. Everyone had their own home. If the elder went into the hospital, they died there. My Dad's Mom had a stroke at 91 so she had to leave her single family home and go into a nursing home, died months later. My cousin's Mom finally had to go into a nursing home at 100 because she could no longer function, died weeks later, otherwise she lived in her own home, and her son [only child] didn't live with her. Same with my other cousins.

It wasn't until I started reading this website here that I learned that grown children were under the same roof as their elder parents. None of my friends were caring under roof with their parents.... nor anyone in my peer group doing the same. My boss was caring for his wife, so that was a different ballgame, yet none of their 6 children were under roof with them, he hired Caregivers.

So we all come from different backgrounds, different cultures, different family dynamics. This is all a learning curve for all of us.
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I just stumbled on this while searching for assistance for my parents, both in their 80"s. I agree, my father expects us to be there for him, he's always telling everyone, "oh I have 4 daughters" so no rehab, etc., because he has 4 daughters. I have health issues myself and I and my 3 sisters were splitting up the time between us, well with my health I had to quit work and quit being a caregiver. My husband and I both have heart conditions and I have several other health issues at this time. Anyway when I quit being a caregiver my parents told me that was fine and that I had to take care of myself. Well my sisters were a different story. They accused me of never wanting to be a caregiver in the first place, and have barely spoken to me since, almost a year now. I think they are very resentful being put in the caregiver situation and think I am out enjoying myself, I don't have a week on the calendar without some kind of Dr. appointment. I had major back surgery in June 2014. But they still think I am dodging my responsibility.
But like many of you have said, caregivers are giving up part of their lives with their husbands/wives, children and grandchildren and I think this is part of my sisters resentment and they are taking it out on me. One of my sisters have told me she has no respect for me, when in reality I think she has no respect for herself because she feels forced into a situation she doesn't want to be in. I love my parents and would be helping if I could.
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Ashlynne, I certainly understand your situation. I had to chuckle at the whistle comment. My dad hasn't thought of that or I am certain I would have been asked to do the same.
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My mom has "one daughter", but this one daughter is not:

1. A trained nurse
2. A certified physical therapist or occupational therapist
3. A janitor
4. Trained in the mandatory health & safety regulations of dealing with bodily fluids and sick people
5. A dietician
6. An Activities Specialist who has been educated on what kind of activities which type of patient needs for stimulation
7. Able to lift heavy loads
8. Able to safely transfer an adult human being with limited mobility
9. Aware of what side effects could happen or what they look like when they are happening
10. A psychiatric nurse
11. A dog to call on demand
12. In possession of industrial grade laundry machines to handle very large loads
13. A taxi service
14. Able to do more than one of the above at the same time. Nobody can.

So there are 12 reasons why I won't even consider care in my home for my narcissistic dementia-having mother.
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This is an interesting discussion, I just turned 60 with 3 sibs and 2 elderly parents, 86 and 87, who still live independently but are increasingly needing help and attention. Mom has always told me that "I don't want to go to the poor house," and "I don't want you kids to have to take care of me." This puts me in a quandary as I worry about them but am trying not to make them reliant on me. Sister lives out of state, one brother is temporarily out of state, and one brother who lives nearby has opted out of any assistance. I am single, no kids, and have spent the last 30 years saving for my own retirement and old age. My parents are living on SS and have nothing of value other than a modest family home. They are coping on their own and really make few demands on me but I know that in the near future I will be the one having to deal with all of this. I have made it a point of telling them "if you need me to find you a plumber, a roofer, a gardner, etc. I will, but I am not going to do it for you, I hire people to do those things for me." I have urged them to move to a nearby senior apartment community that I will help subsidize but they cant face giving up 4 bedrooms, an attic, and a full basement of "stuff." When I consider if I am being selfish I remind myself that from age 6-21 I lived at home and with my sister and did most of the house cleaning, bed making, helping with meals and cleaning the kitchen, and laundry. So I consider them well paid for my food and keep. And once I turned 14 I used my baby sitting money for my own clothes and other personal needs. I got a job at 15 that helped pay for other needs, college fees, gas money, eventually a car. And although I lived at home into my 20's I did my own laundry, cleaning, cooking and paid Mom rent. So no, as heartless as it sounds I don't feel they are entitled to my 24/7 attention. Any help they need is available to them for a small fee in their community, I can help them access it as long as they insist on being independent. I love them but it is not good for any of us to make me the unpaid caregiver.
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sandwich42plus, don't forget:

15. Faster than a speeding bullet
16. More powerful than a locomotive
16. Able to leap tall buildings at a single bound

I know exactly how you feel. I've mentioned to my parents that whenever they need an extra pair of hands around the house, in their best interest to hire an experienced certified caregiver who knows exactly what to do.
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My mother's "sense of entitlement" has lessened a bit since my husband developed dementia and the disease is progressing rapidly. Initially, she wanted me to leave my home and him and move into her house to care for her and my mentally ill brother. And it had to be according to how she wants everything done. She has been difficult all of my life and it is making my life living hell! I know that my husband is my primary responsibility. My priority is him. And since she refused to move to my city so that I could take care of them here as well, she has fend for herself since all the outside help I have gotten for her is not accepted. It is hard to deal with the guilt and the dread. When she becomes bedridden, I don't know what I can do then. I don't have any answers. But I will pray for all other caregivers who are doing God's work. God bless you all
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I was listening to some 80+ year old men talking today and thought how relevant it was to this thread. They were talking about what they would want if they married again. The consensus was that they wanted a woman young enough to take care of them, and one who would let them leave their assets to their own children. They didn't want their kids to lose their inheritance to the new wife. I didn't say anything, but wondered why they thought any woman would do this -- marry them to be their caregiver and get nothing in return. Then I thought about how it is the mindset of many elders that we read about here when it comes to their own children. Today I read another thread about a daughter who quit her job to move in with her father, who refused to help her financially in return when things got bad. What creates this mindset, I don't know. There needs to be some quid pro quo or the caregiver can face poverty on down the road.
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JessieBelle - AMEN & Hallelujah. There needs to be a contract in place to define the caregiving job and remuneration. Even between family members. Otherwise, somebody is going to be taken advantage of somehow.
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In general, I don't feel like anybody is entitled to be entitled for the most part. I do the things I can and choose what will let me sleep at night. If it's not what my mom wanted, well, too late now. Guess you should have been willing to plan ahead and work with the people who could have helped you instead of being a recalcitrant paranoid biddy decades before the dementia set in. We are all just doing the best we can here.
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JessieBelle, oh my gosh, I would want to go over to those 80+ fellows and give them a reality lesson. If the guy has any money, there are the Anna Nicole Smith's of the world who would eventually get them to change their Wills :P
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I would love to hear an analysis why anyone thinks it would be okay to use another person like this. I guess they figure that letting the woman live with their delightful selves would be enough.
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My parents are both dead and I am an only child. My problem is the 92yr. old uncle that is still hanging on and he isn't even my blood kin. He was married to my mother's sister that died a couple of yrs. ago at the age of 93. They had no children and spent their time making my life hell until I had enough and ran away at 19 and married my husband. We lived in another state 1,000 miles from them until about 20yrs. ago when they decided to move near me so I could take care of them in their old age. My mother and father were both dead by this time. Alright, I helped take care of her until just a few months before she died (cooked meals, took them to dr., ran errands). She had Alzheimers and I finally convinced him to put her in a nursing home when he could no longer keep up with her. I got the guilt trip because I didn't move in to help him with her. I have a husband, two adult children, and two grandchildren that uncle thought were not as important as him and aunt. She has been dead about 4yrs. now and he still lives by himself, but expects me to fix his meals and take him places and still run his errands. You have no idea how sick I am of that man!!!! His family has had nothing to do with him for yrs. and he has only 1 friend that comes by to check on him or calls him every few days. Mind you, he was the "creepy uncle" that tried to molest me and chased off my friends and especially boyfriends when I was young. I am 62yrs. old and would love a life without him in it before I die. I swear he will outlive me. Like someone else on here said, I also was raised being told I should never get married because I was the only one there was to take care of all 4 of them when they got old. They were so mad when I ran off and got married that my mother was the only one that talked to me for about a yr. I guess I stick with helping him because it was so ingrained in me as a child that I was responsible for them all. I just don't want to spend whatever life I have left messing with him and his needs. It has bothered me so much lately that I even talked to my pastor about this. I feel bad for him because he is alone, but the life he lived and his choices made it that way for him. Thanks for listening to my vent.
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Tinyblu, you hit the nail on the head at the other end of the spectrum. I too am 'childfree': do not call me childless. there is a difference.
Fortunately, I have not been 'bingoed' much my life. However, this is what a lot of other childfree encounter: the bingo from others 'who will take care of you in your old age??' This is a REAL attitude out there; and whether or not one has kids, this seems to be the prevailing and multiplying attitude. I think this tends to be the easiest path which is why so many travel it.
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